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[Guide] Cosmic Raven's Version of Heavy Questing

DeletedUser23444

so due to the habitat I can run just about pure alchemist, and simply concentrate on supply quests for now.

Unfortunately, you will need some coins production. We needs coins to spend on UBQs. But this doesn't mean you guild hop for coins, you city should be producing coins. This is why I said previously that your Habitat is going to hold you back. It doesn't matter that Habitat produces coins, because it cannot be buffed by a St. Marks bonus, nor doubled by motivation. And Habitat provides so much population per level, that it throws a lower age city completely out-of-balance as far as population vs coins production.

Normally I coach players to delay constructing any population GB, until they have acquired at least 5 such ultra-efficient coins production buildings, such as: SoK, SoA, The King, The Queen, Ziggurat, Haunted House.In this regard, yu have put the cart before the horse.

So to correct the situation you need to add few of whichever structures you have technology unlocked for that can produce the most total coins-per-tile / 24-hours that also provide the LEAST amount of population-per-tile. And you also want to score as many ultra-efficient coins production buildings (that can be motivated) whenever you get the opportunity

will GE give out special buildings like a SoK, or are these event only?

We used to be able to score SoKs in GE; however this is no longer the case, since they released the update that changed many GE prizes to GE-themed buildings. The closest structure we score in GE now is the 3x2 Sacred Skywatch (SSW). The SSW is 50% larger than the SoK, provides a touch more population density than the SoK (but both buildings provide very little population), produces exactly the same coins-per-tile (but SSW pile-o-coins is larger since the building is larger), and both buildings produce 1 FP per day when motivated. Ordinarily I coach HMA and CA players to have no more than 1 SSW in their city, since if they can fit 2 more 3x2 buildings, they should be Alchemists or Clockmakers. However, your case is somewhat unique in that you really need more coins production (and the +1 FP doesn't hurt) to offset your Habitat. So you should be adding as many as you can get your hands on.

In GE can I negotiate the first two levels or is it too costly?

Completing the first 2 GE levels should be feasible for any HQS player in HMA, once you get all the recommended GBs up and running.

Completing GE level III and level IV will all depend on your HQS city design, how set up your are to work HQS efficiently, and the total GB levels you have in the Holy Trinity of HQS GBs: CF + StM + LoA. Once you get all three of these GBs up to about level 5, then you should be rolling in goods with which you can negotiate GE Levels I, II, and III without feeling any pain.

However, I do not advise that HMA players complete GE level IV, regardless if you fight or negotiate — the total cost for you to complete Level IV, compared to what you can score from the GE level, compared to how many of those prizes are actually valuable enough to use in an HQS city that is still in HMA makes it such that completing GE level IV isn't worth it. The math on this will change slightly upward each higher time period between Colonial Age through PE. However, from PME onward, completing level IV is much more valuable to you. This has mainly to do with the special buildings that we can score. Once we are in an unrefined goods period (that is not named The Modern Era, which is an excellent HQS time period), then more special buildings that we can score from GE/ToR Relics become valuable enough to add to an HQS city.



-- had a great day yesterday with my meager questing 125 medals and 4 medium forge packs --- that was like wow... I know this is rare considering it was 7 majors out of 20 or so quests

Here are some interesting quest reward occurrences that I made notes of:

  • In both HMA and CA, I have scored up to as many five 5-packs of FPs in-a-row, meaning 5 recurring quests that I completed contiguously and consecutively all paid me a 5-pack of FPs. Believe it or not, this happened several times. On the flip side of variance, there were also days with only a single 5-pack of FPs from the same sized city. However, once I was in CA, I never had single day where I didn't score at least 1 5-pack, and that would be a very poor day as far as RNG goes.

  • In FE, I have score as many a 6 medals packages in-a-row (and each package was 2,250 medals).

  • I have scored as many as 15 x 5 Packs of FPs in a single day of questing. This doesn't happen often though. I'm pretty sure this was back in CA or Ind, but I never wrote down when period it was.

  • In CA, I would often produce between 200 and 600 CA goods per day, and my CF was never above level 6 when I was in the Colonial Age.

  • In CA, I would often produce between 500 and 1,000 medals per day, and my CF was never above level 6 when I was in the Colonial Age.
 

DeletedUser23444

Just thought I would share my city after reading your guide. It may not be perfect but i was a few months into the game before i came across your guide. Being a new player, your guide has been extremely helpful and given me direction. Thank you, -Oxrin (USA F-World)

Welcome aboard! One piece of advice.

Your Kiosk is 3 x 2, which is the same size as 1 HMA Alchemist or CA Clockmaker. Now if you have an extra 3 x 2 plot of land, no problem. However at some point, you might need that 3x2 plot of land to add another Alchemist/Clockmaker to complete a set of 2 for a quest multiple. At that time, you should spend a Storage Kit on your Kiosk to save it in your Inventory for later in the game (PME or later), when you are in an unrefined goods era (that is not named Modern Era, which is excellent for working HQS). I would not want a Kiosk down in HMA or CA. Keep in mind that 2 x Alchemist/Clockmakers = 2 x 24-hour supply productions + 1 random quest reward. Also, the 1 random quest reward could be:

  • 5 FPs (which is worth more than either 5 HMA goods or 5 CA goods from the Kiosk)

  • A medals package (which is worth more than either 5 HMA goods or 5 CA goods from the Kiosk)

  • A goods package (which is worth the same as either 5 HMA goods or 5 CA goods from the Kiosk; however once you own CF, the goods package will be worth more)
So over time, in either HMA or CA, the Kiosk loses out to the supply buildings, and the more levels your CF gets, the more the Kiosk loses. However, this all changes dramatically in PME and later, since a quest multiple is 5 x 24 hour supply productions, not 2, and the goods produced by both quest rewards and quests are PME goods, which are refined goods. I would love to own a whole row of Kiosks locked to various time periods from PME and later.
 

DeletedUser29206

lol I'm all excited about 125 medal and you are scoring them 2500 at a time :p

@kobnach & CR... so for high middle ages what would you suggest, should I unlock the military techs,
--- i'm still fairly early on in this era, is it worth fighting my way thru guild expeditions ... at this stage...
CR you mention it as "once you get all the recommended GBs up and running" is this a caveat?
any particular level these GBs should be at?
--- next what type of military should I concentrate on -- Will I need all five types- or can this be done with 3 or 4 types of units
--- how many unattached units do I need to successfully fight thru each level ---

the main question being --- should I forgo this and run without any or very minimal military -- pending additional land expansions
-- do we get unlimited victory expansions as long as medals are available, or is there a limit based on current age?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

so my basic thinking was more alchemists equals more chances at fps and medal, = faster GB growth and more land to play with
Phase 1.
-- push the Hag to level 10, which in turn allows me to free up some of the happiness land for coin production.
--- instinctively I have a feeling this will be critical in my case.

sort of approaching it backwards due to the habitat, -- yes I know cart before the horse
--- just an old trick I've used successfully many time... when a problem is hindering progress going forward solve it from the end state working your way back to the sticking point... i.e. reverse engineer the problem to solve it.

I do not have any of the offset buildings you speak of, and from the sounds of it, this will at best, take some considerable time to get them.
- in this case it is called system-d and working with the resources currently available.
this is a good read into what system -d is --- the short version macgyver it
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/28/books/chapters/0528-1st-bour.html

So...again due to the major hang up of the habitat ... and the serious lag it will cost me

Phase 2. (with happiness taken care of)
--- I can free up some land for coin production... without worrying about added population.
--- the medals expansion also provides additional space for military and coins.

therefore
--- I can then do the same with the CF and push it to level 10, while shooting for the 8 million plus coins.
--- the other 2 GBs at level 5 feels right, I do not think they would be worth pushing further within HMA.
--- at this point
--- I can also jump into GE for those special building to replace the housing with, and hopefully balance the city to some extent.

-- the key here being I can spam the supply quest full force (minimum 72 alchemist) thru both phases, and walk into CA with a slightly larger snowball.
--- the only downside I can see here is potentially not spending enough time in CA because the great buildings leveled up too quickly?
--- possibly missing a critical element needed in CA

--- how many coins needed before leaving HMA
--- ditto for supplies and goods ... do you have the math on this?

--- your guide seems to indicate getting GBs to level 5 and then sprint for clock makers.

--- sort of weary about jumping into CA without the needed resources for the jump.
--- coming into HMA I was a little premature in the sense of coins needed to build out a field of alchemists. ...bare minimum 450k coins to build 30 alchemists, much less 72 alchemists at 1.08m coins.

--- agreed guild hopping is not the most efficient way of collecting coins
--- still learning here, so bear with me... I do truly appreciate the time you are taking in analyzing this and sharing your wealth of knowledge.

another alternative I been playing with is
--- what are your thoughts on an Atonium? same size as the hag 42 tiles, but provides 4,200 happines at lvl5
--- the Traz on the other hand at 70 tiles provides 4800 happiness at level 5 + unattached troops for GE
----------- part of the working it out in reverse
---hehe, I'm guessing sticking it out with what I currently have and just grind thru it, at whatever pace it takes to get to the next level.
 

yochananmichael

New Member
lol I'm all excited about 125 medal and you are scoring them 2500 at a time :p

@kobnach & CR... so for high middle ages what would you suggest, should I unlock the military techs,
--- i'm still fairly early on in this era, is it worth fighting my way thru guild expeditions ... at this stage...
CR you mention it as "once you get all the recommended GBs up and running" is this a caveat?
any particular level these GBs should be at?
--- next what type of military should I concentrate on -- Will I need all five types- or can this be done with 3 or 4 types of units
--- how many unattached units do I need to successfully fight thru each level ---

the main question being --- should I forgo this and run without any or very minimal military -- pending additional land expansions
-- do we get unlimited victory expansions as long as medals are available, or is there a limit based on current age?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

so my basic thinking was more alchemists equals more chances at fps and medal, = faster GB growth and more land to play with
Phase 1.
-- push the Hag to level 10, which in turn allows me to free up some of the happiness land for coin production.
--- instinctively I have a feeling this will be critical in my case.

sort of approaching it backwards due to the habitat, -- yes I know cart before the horse
--- just an old trick I've used successfully many time... when a problem is hindering progress going forward solve it from the end state working your way back to the sticking point... i.e. reverse engineer the problem to solve it.

I do not have any of the offset buildings you speak of, and from the sounds of it, this will at best, take some considerable time to get them.
- in this case it is called system-d and working with the resources currently available.
this is a good read into what system -d is --- the short version macgyver it
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/28/books/chapters/0528-1st-bour.html

So...again due to the major hang up of the habitat ... and the serious lag it will cost me

Phase 2. (with happiness taken care of)
--- I can free up some land for coin production... without worrying about added population.
--- the medals expansion also provides additional space for military and coins.

therefore
--- I can then do the same with the CF and push it to level 10, while shooting for the 8 million plus coins.
--- the other 2 GBs at level 5 feels right, I do not think they would be worth pushing further within HMA.
--- at this point
--- I can also jump into GE for those special building to replace the housing with, and hopefully balance the city to some extent.

-- the key here being I can spam the supply quest full force (minimum 72 alchemist) thru both phases, and walk into CA with a slightly larger snowball.
--- the only downside I can see here is potentially not spending enough time in CA because the great buildings leveled up too quickly?
--- possibly missing a critical element needed in CA

--- how many coins needed before leaving HMA
--- ditto for supplies and goods ... do you have the math on this?

--- your guide seems to indicate getting GBs to level 5 and then sprint for clock makers.

--- sort of weary about jumping into CA without the needed resources for the jump.
--- coming into HMA I was a little premature in the sense of coins needed to build out a field of alchemists. ...bare minimum 450k coins to build 30 alchemists, much less 72 alchemists at 1.08m coins.

--- agreed guild hopping is not the most efficient way of collecting coins
--- still learning here, so bear with me... I do truly appreciate the time you are taking in analyzing this and sharing your wealth of knowledge.

another alternative I been playing with is
--- what are your thoughts on an Atonium? same size as the hag 42 tiles, but provides 4,200 happines at lvl5
--- the Traz on the other hand at 70 tiles provides 4800 happiness at level 5 + unattached troops for GE
----------- part of the working it out in reverse
---hehe, I'm guessing sticking it out with what I currently have and just grind thru it, at whatever pace it takes to get to the next level.

To answer your questions in order Magi

1. Your HS needs to be at least level 5. Mine is level 6 and I am -5 happiness from having a fully enthused city if I removed it. Per CR most of the time a level 5 HS will fully enthuse a HMA city. I just have a litte more Alcs and military and so my pop needs are a little higher which is why mine will need to be level 7 for a fully enthused city

2. CF needs to be level 5 or 6 in HMA

3. I currently have 54 Alcs in my city along with a HS, LoA, StM, and CF. I still need to get CdM and am working on the prints and already have bought the goods off of CR. I am almost done with the land that I need for HMA to be fully realized and I am like 898 medals away from a new medals pack and yes as long as you have the medals to buy them you can place them they are not age locked like the diamond expansions.

4. You are going to need some kind of military. I currently have 4 of the 5 military barracks unlocked. Trebs will be unlocked at the upcoming Shah Jahan event. As far as what you need I have 2 Crossbow ranges (they require the smallest pop cost), 1 Heavy Infantry and 1 Knight barracks. That will get you through fighting GE just fine. but once you unlock Trebs stop and only do the middle techs from HMA for events.

5. You will need a minimum of 8 M Coins and 8 M supplies give or take for the sprint to Clockmakers, along with a stock of goods for any additional GB from the lower eras that you have not placed that are on the HQS GB list and unlocking techs for your sprint, and a complete remodel of your city anything above that is good for spamming UBQs. In my case its CoA and SoZ and while I have all the prints and goods I need to place them I have not due to wanting to get CdM first as it pays for itself as CR points out and I need the land for supply production.

6. Traz and Atom are great, for colonial. Get your 5 snowball GB and level them to at least level 5. You will get the others and push them to level 10 in Colonial as per CR its the most lucrative age to work HQS

Hope that helps
 

DeletedUser29206

To answer your questions in order Magi

1. Your HS needs to be at least level 5. Mine is level 6 and I am -5 happiness from having a fully enthused city if I removed it. Per CR most of the time a level 5 HS will fully enthuse a HMA city. I just have a litte more Alcs and military and so my pop needs are a little higher which is why mine will need to be level 7 for a fully enthused city

2. CF needs to be level 5 or 6 in HMA

3. I currently have 54 Alcs in my city along with a HS, LoA, StM, and CF. I still need to get CdM and am working on the prints and already have bought the goods off of CR. I am almost done with the land that I need for HMA to be fully realized and I am like 898 medals away from a new medals pack and yes as long as you have the medals to buy them you can place them they are not age locked like the diamond expansions.

4. You are going to need some kind of military. I currently have 4 of the 5 military barracks unlocked. Trebs will be unlocked at the upcoming Shah Jahan event. As far as what you need I have 2 Crossbow ranges (they require the smallest pop cost), 1 Heavy Infantry and 1 Knight barracks. That will get you through fighting GE just fine. but once you unlock Trebs stop and only do the middle techs from HMA for events.

5. You will need a minimum of 8 M Coins and 8 M supplies give or take for the sprint to Clockmakers, along with a stock of goods for any additional GB from the lower eras that you have not placed that are on the HQS GB list and unlocking techs for your sprint, and a complete remodel of your city anything above that is good for spamming UBQs. In my case its CoA and SoZ and while I have all the prints and goods I need to place them I have not due to wanting to get CdM first as it pays for itself as CR points out and I need the land for supply production.

6. Traz and Atom are great, for colonial. Get your 5 snowball GB and level them to at least level 5. You will get the others and push them to level 10 in Colonial as per CR its the most lucrative age to work HQS

Hope that helps

thank you this answered my questions ... will work it as such
 

DeletedUser28021

To answer your questions in order Magi

1. Your HS needs to be at least level 5. Mine is level 6 and I am -5 happiness from having a fully enthused city if I removed it. Per CR most of the time a level 5 HS will fully enthuse a HMA city. I just have a litte more Alcs and military and so my pop needs are a little higher which is why mine will need to be level 7 for a fully enthused city

I must be doing something wrong. My HMA city and its 54 alchs get all the happiness I need from roads and a single church. Plus some event buildings I maybe shouldn't still have, but they give FP. And yes I'll admit it, a couple of decorations I kept because they were cute. No HS.

Of course I'm rather a beginner at this still. It'll be a while before I have a real HQS city, if I ever do.

But I'm guessing that the difference in this case is that I have no population being used to support military buildings. (My guild doesn't need me in GvG, so I'm not implementing that part of the guide.) This gives me more land usable for alchemists, allowing me to keep stuff I really shouldn't have, or shouldn't have *yet*.
 

yochananmichael

New Member
I must be doing something wrong. My HMA city and its 54 alchs get all the happiness I need from roads and a single church. Plus some event buildings I maybe shouldn't still have, but they give FP. And yes I'll admit it, a couple of decorations I kept because they were cute. No HS.

Of course I'm rather a beginner at this still. It'll be a while before I have a real HQS city, if I ever do.

But I'm guessing that the difference in this case is that I have no population being used to support military buildings. (My guild doesn't need me in GvG, so I'm not implementing that part of the guide.) This gives me more land usable for alchemists, allowing me to keep stuff I really shouldn't have, or shouldn't have *yet*.

Well, then your happiness is coming from all the above then. Your roads, your church, the special buildings and your decorations. I only have my alchs and military and as few roads as possible to maximize the useable land I do have. I have all my happy coming from 3 things, Roads, Church, and a level 6 HS. I can dump the church when my HS reaches level 7.
 

DeletedUser26965

In CA, I would often produce between 200 and 600 CA goods per day, and my CF was never above level 6 when I was in the Colonial Age.
600 goods in a day? I'd love to see the breakdown of how that's possible. How many clockmakers? How many quests? etc.
 

DeletedUser29218

600 goods in a day? I'd love to see the breakdown of how that's possible. How many clockmakers? How many quests? etc.
My excel sheet projects 300 goods/day in HMA after leveling CF, with no LoA yet, and some buildings CR doesn't recommend (but are actually better for my city). So 600 goods/day on a established CA city doesn't sound off at all.

Anyway, you don't need that many goods. With 160/day (which is my current output) + tabern 15m boost + free unatached units and a rogue hideout I'm finishing lvl IV GE.

That's the reason I have cherry garden and a garden ruins sets. Once you have enough goods you gain "nothing" by getting more, so all the focus should go towards maximizing FPs. Those 2 sets provide more FP than Alchemist+houses. And, with my current city size, they are also enough to fullfill al happiness requirements without any need of cultural buildings or HS.
 

Opozicija

New Member
I red all pages and I didnt find similiar city like mine so I would be very happy if Cosmic Raven could comment my situation. Anyway, I get it usefull when CR comment specific situation because most of us want/need to adopt..

I am getting about 200 goods and 87 FPs (without tavern) daily in HMA and I dont have HQS city YET. I play in GE guild (D world) and I do GE (all 4.lvls). I found this guide very interesting but since I start reading it before 1 month its kind of hard to implement all suggestions before thinking twice. I play FoE 10 months, for now I have:
1.Cdm_12,
2.Arc_10
3.Hagia_10
4.CoA_10
5.Zeus_10
6.Cape_8
7.LoA_7
8.St.B_6
9.St.Mark_5
10.Inno_5
11.Dyn_5
12.ToR_5
13.Chateau_4

-48 expansions (next one costs me 40 000 medals)
-6 SoK, 1SSW
-cherry set, ruin set, lord mannor, 1 bazaar,1 masquarade ball, 1 Aviary, 1 Caravansary, 1 Oasis, 1 Checkmate
-3 terrace,3 WW
- 1 champion and 2 rogue hideouts
- 8 Alchemist

I also have some stuff that I dont need (confectionary, cider mill) and that will be very soon sold.
I plunder a lot so I get a lot of goods, FPs. Also I chase free rewards in others GBs and with combination of Arc I really get a lot of medals and FPs. For most of GBs I have BPs enough for 20-30 lvl.

My questions to CR before I start to redesign city:
1.Is HQS city for me good choice?
2.Should I destroy Terraces?

ps. If I manage, I will put picture of city..I am new here..:)

https://ibb.co/jM2BOF
edit:Forgot on St.Mark
 
Last edited:

DeletedUser23444

600 goods in a day? I'd love to see the breakdown of how that's possible. How many clockmakers? How many quests? etc.

I'm going to use this question as an opportunity to peel back some layers of the onion and show everyone some of the inner workings of HQS.

First, you must keep in mind that when I say that I scored as many as 600 goods on a single day, that would also mean that I didn't score as many medals packages nor as many 5- Packs of FPs on that same day. So when the frequency of scoring one prize goes up, it means the frequency of scoring other prizes will go down, assuming the total number of completed quests remains constant. Now sometimes we get very lucky, where it is the frequency of scoring: coins, supplies, or blueprints goes down and not the frequency of scoring: FPs, medals, or goods.

Here was my final Colonial Age city plan before I moved up to Industrial Age.
Ravenloft-07-CA-13-GBs.png

NOTE: The game of FoE has changed since back when I was in CA; in today's version this city could actually be expanded further eastward than what this plan shows.

By the time I first got to CA, I had heard so many of my non-HQS guild mates who were up in the later eras (ME through TE at that time), constantly complain about how they never had enough supplies on hand for conventional game play, especially after a major city remodel. This is when I first started studying the entire tech tree, and I noticed that the supplies cost of everything (tech and regular building construction) gets much more supplies intensive in the later game than it was in the early game. This is also when I figured out that a long stay-over in CA, working mainly the "Produce Supplies" quest and "Collect Supplies" quest (in the 2nd recurring slot) had a lot of value, not only for the quest reward loot, but just for the extra large supply production. Most of my later-era guild mates were constructing RAH on top of LoA, in order to meed the demand for supplies that the later game put on them. (However, I must point out that most of those yahoos didn't have their LoA up to level 10 before they constructed RAH, which IMO was wasteful—level up the cheaper and smaller LoA to level 10 1st, then consider whether or not you still need to dedicate the massive 6 x 7 plot of land to own the RAH on top of your level 10 LoA.)

So with all of this in mind, I made raising my LoA to level 10 a priority; and in fact, LoA was my 1st level 10 GB and it reached level 10 about 1/3rd of the way through my long stay over in CA. (FYI, HS was my second level 10 GB about the same time.) About this time is when I decided to take the plunge and add CF to my city (HQS was just starting to form into a mere wisp of the strategy we have today.) And once I saw the CF in action, I had much the same response as many other players, some of whom have posted their testimonials throughout this topic. That was when I first started thinking about how to afford spamming UBQs and how this could best be leveraged, while still stockpiling millions of supplies to have on-hand for the later eras when other players typically run out of supplies. I wanted to see if we could progress through the game without ever constructing RAH, and scoring boatloads of quest rewards while doing it. The answer of course is: "Yes, We can!" To this day, I still only own a level 10 LoA in FE and no RAH. And I have stockpiled enough supplies to take me through the end of the tech tree plus have several million supplies left over for city remodel or two.


But when I started playing around with spamming UBQs, it became apparent that coins, not supplies, was the limiting agent. So I raised my StM up quickly to level 08 in Colonial age. Since I was relying on Gambrel Roof Houses for population and coins production, level 8 StM bonus was enough for my coins to keep pace with supplies. I kept my StM at level 8 all the way until FE; in fact, it wasn't until about 2 or 3 months ago that my StM hit level 10. But by the time I was mid-way through my stay in Colonial Age, I had stockpiled several 10s of millions of both coins and supplies, with my coins stockpile being about 1/5th to 1/3rd the size of my supplies stockpile on any given day. (I often purchase 100s of FPs with coins which is another reason for our supplies stockpile to outpace our coins stockpile.)

Once my CF reached level 6, which was about half way through my long stay over in CA, I started to pay closer attention to the size of the coins packages and supplies packages that quest rewards paid out. I finally realized that owning a level 6 CF wasn't just good for turning a base package of 5 goods into a package of 10 goods, but any time I missed FPs, medals, or goods, and scored coins or supplies instead that I as getting back anywhere from 20% to 50% of my cost of 1 UBQ quest. And half the quests we complete in CA are not UBQs, they are: "Collect Coins", Produce Supplies", "Collect Supplies", and "Spend FPs". In fact, most of the time, UBQs are no more than 50% of total quests we complete per day.

So follow some math here:

  • First let's assume that coins=supplies in terms of value. One might argue this, but IMO their relative value is close enough, since they are both about as easy to produce or score from a quest reward. In HQS, we are really comparing the value of coins and supplies (money that jingles like dimes and quarters) to the value of: FPs, Medals, and Goods (money that folds like 10 and 20 dollar bills).

  • My city had a level 6 CF, which gives a bonus of +100% to the packages of: coins, supplies, medals, and goods. The numbers I list later have already factored in the CF bonus.

  • My city plan shown above could complete around 80 quests per day: 35 x "Produce Supplies", 35 UBQs, 6 x Collect Supplies, 3 x Collect coins, 1 x Spend FPs. Sometimes, I could complete more Collect Quests, but these numbers are conservative enough and consistent enough to work some math around.

  • On Average, 30% of all quests rewards are going to pay 20%-25% of the cost to spam 1 UBQ. This would be either the small coins package or the small supplies package, which after they are buffed by +100% CF bonus, are between 20%-25% of the cost to pay to complete 1 UBQ.

  • On Average, 20% of all quests rewards are going to pay 45%-50% of the cost to spam 1 UBQ. This would be the large coins package or the large supplies package, which after they are buffed by +100% CF bonus, are between 45%-50% of the cost to pay to complete 1 UBQ.

  • 80 total quests x 30% small packages x 22.5% average of both packages = 5.4 Free UBQs per day from quest rewards.

  • 80 total quests x 20% large packages x 47.5% average of both packages = 7.6 Free UBQs per day from quest rewards.

  • 5.4 + 7.6 = 13 Free UBQs per day

  • 35 Abort-Cycles (1 UBQ per cycle) - 13 Free UBQs = I only actually pay for 22 UBQs per day out of my city's production, or my coins and supplies stockpiles.

This is why I constantly harp on players to never neglect leveling up the "The Holy Trinity" of HQS GBs, which are: CF, StM, and LoA. This is how they feed into the system. The higher level these three GB are, the more affordable spamming UBQs becomes. And bonus! The higher level CF is, the larger the package size is whenever we score: diamonds, medals, and goods.

Now, the HQS (and in fact the entire game) has changed dramatically since I was questing back in the Colonial Age. I understand HQS far better now than I did back then. For example, I never constructed Innovation Tower back when I was in CA. Instead, I relied on Gambrel Roof Houses for dense population and coins production. But the trouble is that GRHs are near the end of the CA tech tree, and eventually I had to leave CA. It was one of my guild mates that I coached through an earlier version of HQS that added the Innovation Tower to our playbook. We learned that IT (or any pop GB) must be balanced with ultra-efficient coins production buildings (SoK, SoA, The King, The Queen, Ziggurat, Haunted House, and so on); but if we had enough coins production, we could drop all houses and add even more quests. And this also meant we no longer needed to race to GRH technology in order to maximize our total number of quests per day — just construct and level up IT instead and save the technologies to remain in CA longer. And after I saw my guild mate's progress, I realized that the resource that had really held me back from spamming more UBQs back when I was in CA was not my supplie —I had 70 Clockmakers, 40 of them buffed by a level 10 LoA bonus. It was was coins production capacity that really held back UBQs. And when I was in CA I had only raisied my StM up to level 8, not to level 10 like I recommend today. At the time I did that because STM bonuses were so much more efficient than LoA bonuses. But I ended up handicapping myself by not pushing StM and CF both up to level 10—mine were only 8 and 6 respectively. So all of you Noob Minions who come into HQS now, should be able to produce as well as I did, or better. (However, you also will have GE eating away at some of your goods if you negotiate.)

But more importantly than understanding my own mistakes in CA, I realized that all of this could actually start back in HMA, if we just adjusted the GB construction priorities optimally. Thus the HQS has evolved multiple times between when I was in CA and where you all are now. Today, we have you focus 5 and only 5 GBs for HMA: CF, HS, StM, LoA, and CdM. These GBs all lead to scoring more daily loot in some way. And we limit the list to only 5 GBs in HMA because: land is scarce, goods are scarce, and FPs to swap to our GBs are scarce. If we had you construct more GBs in HMA, they would consume far more land, they would consume far more construction goods, and they would all level up much slower since you have the same number of FPs to swap per day. But the 5 GBs we prioritized, are the: Power Rangers / Justice League / Avengers / Voltron / A Team of the FoE universe. Only one of these GBs is actually expensive for an HMA player to construct, which is of course CF. Trading HMA goods up 1:2 for the LMA goods to construct CdM is not so bad; and the other GBs all cost HMA or earlier goods.

In case any of you are wondering why the Arc is not on this list, it's about math. The Arc buffs donation reward packages, which sounds great (and it is great). But except when paying FPs for CF goods, an HMA player is much more likely to swap FPs with a player near his own age and total game progress. (Most later era players want to swap FPs with other later era players, who own higher level GBs.) This means the GBs an HMA player is more likely to swap to are both: lower level GBs, and also earlier age GBs. And this means that the donation rewards paid by any reward slot that an HMA player is going to score in, will not pay a very large base package of: BPs, FPs, and medals. So even if these donations rewards were buffed by an Arc bonus, it would not produce much more additional rewards. The FE goods to construct Arc cost about 2 to 3 times as many FPs as the goods to construct the CF cost. So it makes far more sense to delay construction of the very expensive Arc until the Colonial Age. By then, a player has: a larger city to accommodate more GBs, the ability to complete more quests per day to produce more FPs per day, and all of their HMA GBs will be around the level 5 to 7 range and their swap partner's GBs should be around there as well. Now, when we add the Arc bonus to the donation rewards scored on a GB that is between level 5 and level 10, that Arc bonus starts to add up to something significant. So it makes much more sense to spend a large pile of FPs to construct The Arc in Colonial than it does in HMA.
 
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DeletedUser23444

Anyway, you don't need that many goods.
...

That's the reason I have cherry garden and a garden ruins sets. Once you have enough goods you gain "nothing" by getting more,

Never has a more incorrect statement been typed, at least if we are talking about Colonial Age goods. HMA goods we have a more or less finite demand more. CA goods are the unrefined goods for ME goods. And ME goods are the unrefined goods for TE goods. And TE goods are the unrefined goods for AFE goods. So to produce 10 goods of any type that I just mentioned (except CA goods) we actually will consume 10 CA goods.

I left the Colonial Age with a surplus of over 16,000 CA goods stockpiled. I have consumed them all in the conventional production of either ME or TE goods.

On numerous occasions I have sold FE, CE, PME, ME, or PE goods to many different guild mates, or even players from outside my guild, so they could construct higher era GBs. In many cases, these players have sold me 2 CA goods : 1 Higher Era Good, plus some FP donations to make up the difference in value between their goods and mine. This means I have purchased 1000s and 1000s of CA goods from other players still down in CA. I have consumed nearly all of those CA goods in the conventional production of TE goods. I also have traded some of those CA goods up for Ind goods which I consumed in the conventional production of PME goods. I also tradede some of those CA goods down for LMA goods to have enough on hand to help my HMA Noob Minions trade their HMA goods up for LMA goods.

And none of this speaks to being in the middle of a GvG war that spanned multiple ages where I donated 1000s and 1000s of CA goods to my guild when I was in the Colonial Age and later (on top of the guild goods that came from my Arc or Obs).

Long story short, we never have enough goods. And working HQS is just as much about increasing our goods production as it is medals or FPs.
 
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DeletedUser26965

I'm going to use this question as an opportunity to peel back some layers of the onion and show everyone some of the inner workings of HQS.

First, you must keep in mind that when I say that I scored as many as 600 goods on a single day, that would also mean that I didn't score as many medals packages nor as many 5- Packs of FPs on that same day. So when the frequency of scoring one prize goes up, it means the frequency of scoring other prizes will go down, assuming the total number of completed quests remains constant. Now sometimes we get very lucky, where it is the frequency of scoring: coins, supplies, or blueprints goes down and not the frequency of scoring: FPs, medals, or goods.

Here was my final Colonial Age city plan before I moved up to Industrial Age.
View attachment 4741

NOTE: The game of FoE has changed since back when I was in CA; in today's version this city could actually be expanded further eastward than what this plan shows.

By the time I first got to CA, I had heard so many of my non-HQS guild mates who were up in the later eras (ME through TE at that time), constantly complain about how they never had enough supplies on hand for conventional game play, especially after a major city remodel. This is when I first started studying the entire tech tree, and I noticed that the supplies cost of everything (tech and regular building construction) gets much more supplies intensive in the later game than it was in the early game. This is also when I figured out that a long stay-over in CA, working mainly the "Produce Supplies" quest and "Collect Supplies" quest (in the 2nd recurring slot) had a lot of value, not only for the quest reward loot, but just for the extra large supply production. Most of my later-era guild mates were constructing RAH on top of LoA, in order to meed the demand for supplies that the later game put on them. (However, I must point out that most of those yahoos didn't have their LoA up to level 10 before they constructed RAH, which IMO was wasteful—level up the cheaper and smaller LoA to level 10 1st, then consider whether or not you still need to dedicate the massive 6 x 7 plot of land to own the RAH on top of your level 10 LoA.)

So with all of this in mind, I made raising my LoA to level 10 a priority; and in fact, LoA was my 1st level 10 GB and it reached level 10 about 1/3rd of the way through my long stay over in CA. (FYI, HS was my second level 10 GB about the same time.) About this time is when I decided to take the plunge and add CF to my city (HQS was just starting to form into a mere wisp of the strategy we have today.) And once I saw the CF in action, I had much the same response as many other players, some of whom have posted their testimonials throughout this topic. That was when I first started thinking about how to afford spamming UBQs and how this could best be leveraged, while still stockpiling millions of supplies to have on-hand for the later eras when other players typically run out of supplies. I wanted to see if we could progress through the game without ever constructing RAH, and scoring boatloads of quest rewards while doing it. The answer of course is: "Yes, We can!" To this day, I still only own a level 10 LoA in FE and no RAH. And I have stockpiled enough supplies to take me through the end of the tech tree plus have several million supplies left over for city remodel or two.


But when I started playing around with spamming UBQs, it became apparent that coins, not supplies, was the limiting agent. So I raised my StM up quickly to level 08 in Colonial age. Since I was relying on Gambrel Roof Houses for population and coins production, level 8 StM bonus was enough for my coins to keep pace with supplies. I kept my StM at level 8 all the way until FE; in fact, it wasn't until about 2 or 3 months ago that my StM hit level 10. But by the time I was mid-way through my stay in Colonial Age, I had stockpiled several 10s of millions of both coins and supplies, with my coins stockpile being about 1/5th to 1/3rd the size of my supplies stockpile on any given day. (I often purchase 100s of FPs with coins which is another reason for our supplies stockpile to outpace our coins stockpile.)

Once my CF reached level 6, which was about half way through my long stay over in CA, I started to pay closer attention to the size of the coins packages and supplies packages that quest rewards paid out. I finally realized that owning a level 6 CF wasn't just good for turning a base package of 5 goods into a package of 10 goods, but any time I missed FPs, medals, or goods, and scored coins or supplies instead that I as getting back anywhere from 20% to 50% of my cost of 1 UBQ quest. And half the quests we complete in CA are not UBQs, they are: "Collect Coins", Produce Supplies", "Collect Supplies", and "Spend FPs". In fact, most of the time, UBQs are no more than 50% of total quests we complete per day.

So follow some math here:

  • First let's assume that coins=supplies in terms of value. One might argue this, but IMO their relative value is close enough, since they are both about as easy to produce or score from a quest reward. In HQS, we are really comparing the value of coins and supplies (money that jingles like dimes and quarters) to the value of: FPs, Medals, and Goods (money that folds like 10 and 20 dollar bills).

  • My city had a level 6 CF, which gives a bonus of +100% to the packages of: coins, supplies, medals, and goods. The numbers I list later have already factored in the CF bonus.

  • My city plan shown above could complete around 80 quests per day: 35 x "Produce Supplies", 35 UBQs, 6 x Collect Supplies, 3 x Collect coins, 1 x Spend FPs. Sometimes, I could complete more Collect Quests, but these numbers are conservative enough and consistent enough to work some math around.

  • On Average, 30% of all quests rewards are going to pay 20%-25% of the cost to spam 1 UBQ. This would be either the small coins package or the small supplies package, which after they are buffed by +100% CF bonus, are between 20%-25% of the cost to pay to complete 1 UBQ.

  • On Average, 20% of all quests rewards are going to pay 45%-50% of the cost to spam 1 UBQ. This would be the large coins package or the large supplies package, which after they are buffed by +100% CF bonus, are between 45%-50% of the cost to pay to complete 1 UBQ.

  • 80 total quests x 30% small packages x 22.5% average of both packages = 5.4 Free UBQs per day from quest rewards.

  • 80 total quests x 20% large packages x 47.5% average of both packages = 7.6 Free UBQs per day from quest rewards.

  • 5.4 + 7.6 = 13 Free UBQs per day

  • 35 Abort-Cycles (1 UBQ per cycle) - 13 Free UBQs = I only actually pay for 22 UBQs per day out of my city's production, or my coins and supplies stockpiles.

This is why I constantly harp on players to never neglect leveling up the "The Holy Trinity" of HQS GBs, which are: CF, StM, and LoA. This is how they feed into the system. The higher level these three GB are, the more affordable spamming UBQs becomes. And bonus! The higher level CF is, the larger the package size is whenever we score: diamonds, medals, and goods.

Now, the HQS (and in fact the entire game) has changed dramatically since I was questing back in the Colonial Age. I understand HQS far better now than I did back then. For example, I never constructed Innovation Tower back when I was in CA. Instead, I relied on Gambrel Roof Houses for dense population and coins production. But the trouble is that GRHs are near the end of the CA tech tree, and eventually I had to leave CA. It was one of my guild mates that I coached through an earlier version of HQS that added the Innovation Tower to our playbook. We learned that IT (or any pop GB) must be balanced with ultra-efficient coins production buildings (SoK, SoA, The King, The Queen, Ziggurat, Haunted House, and so on); but if we had enough coins production, we could drop all houses and add even more quests. And this also meant we no longer needed to race to GRH technology in order to maximize our total number of quests per day — just construct and level up IT instead and save the technologies to remain in CA longer. And after I saw my guild mate's progress, I realized that the resource that had really held me back from spamming more UBQs back when I was in CA was not my supplie —I had 70 Clockmakers, 40 of them buffed by a level 10 LoA bonus. It was was coins production capacity that really held back UBQs. And when I was in CA I had only raisied my StM up to level 8, not to level 10 like I recommend today. At the time I did that because STM bonuses were so much more efficient than LoA bonuses. But I ended up handicapping myself by not pushing StM and CF both up to level 10—mine were only 8 and 6 respectively. So all of you Noob Minions who come into HQS now, should be able to produce as well as I did, or better. (However, you also will have GE eating away at some of your goods if you negotiate.)

But more importantly than understanding my own mistakes in CA, I realized that all of this could actually start back in HMA, if we just adjusted the GB construction priorities optimally. Thus the HQS has evolved multiple times between when I was in CA and where you all are now. Today, we have you focus 5 and only 5 GBs for HMA: CF, HS, StM, LoA, and CdM. These GBs all lead to scoring more daily loot in some way. And we limit the list to only 5 GBs in HMA because: land is scarce, goods are scarce, and FPs to swap to our GBs are scarce. If we had you construct more GBs in HMA, they would consume far more land, they would consume far more construction goods, and they would all level up much slower since you have the same number of FPs to swap per day. But the 5 GBs we prioritized, are the: Power Rangers / Justice League / Avengers / Voltron / A Team of the FoE universe. Only one of these GBs is actually expensive for an HMA player to construct, which is of course CF. Trading HMA goods up 1:2 for the LMA goods to construct CdM is not so bad; and the other GBs all cost HMA or earlier goods.

In case any of you are wondering why the Arc is not on this list, it's about math. The Arc buffs donation reward packages, which sounds great (and it is great). But except when paying FPs for CF goods, an HMA player is much more likely to swap FPs with a player near his own age and total game progress. (Most later era players want to swap FPs with other later era players, who own higher level GBs.) This means the GBs an HMA player is more likely to swap to are both: lower level GBs, and also earlier age GBs. And this means that the donation rewards paid by any reward slot that an HMA player is going to score in, will not pay a very large base package of: BPs, FPs, and medals. So even if these donations rewards were buffed by an Arc bonus, it would not produce much more additional rewards. The FE goods to construct Arc cost about 2 to 3 times as many FPs as the goods to construct the CF cost. So it makes far more sense to delay construction of the very expensive Arc until the Colonial Age. By then, a player has: a larger city to accommodate more GBs, the ability to complete more quests per day to produce more FPs per day, and all of their HMA GBs will be around the level 5 to 7 range and their swap partner's GBs should be around there as well. Now, when we add the Arc bonus to the donation rewards scored on a GB that is between level 5 and level 10, that Arc bonus starts to add up to something significant. So it makes much more sense to spend a large pile of FPs to construct The Arc in Colonial than it does in HMA.

35 x "Produce Supplies"
by that do you mean the quest where you collect two 24h productions?
 

DeletedUser23444

My questions to CR before I start to redesign city:
1.Is HQS city for me good choice?
2.Should I destroy Terraces?

Wow, you've been in HMA a long time! Make no mistake, you are as far from working HQS as you possibly can get in an HMA city. Since your city is so tricky, I'm not going to advise you on what you should do with your city. Instead, I'm going to say what I would do if that were my own city and make some other ocmments for the benefit of other players.

Taking into account what I know about how HQS works, here us what I would do with that city, if it were my city:
  1. Sell my sister and my mother to get up to Colonial Age ASAP so that I had a lot more land to work HQS on. This city is consuming so much land on GBs, most of which with many GB level, so the only way to get more land is to advance to CA. This would mean going "Full Tech Speed Ahead" (with the city as it is right now) until unlocking CA Clockmaking technology (skipping what techs can be skipped along the way). The next steps all would come after reaching CA.

  2. Store the Confectionery and Cider Mill to keep them for much later in the game (AFE or later), when we will use mainly special or premium supply production buildings to produce supplies.

  3. Store the Wishing Wells / Fountains or Youth for much later in the game (PME or later). These are much more valuable in PME and later. We don't use them in ME, because the HQS building in ME is the 3 x 3 Hatter. ME Wells / Fountains produce x2 CA goods (but we park in CA long time to produce CA goods). In contrast, 5 x ME Hatters can produce ME goods from quest rewards.

  4. Sell the StB. An HQS city requires 0% city defense bonus because we have no plunder-able buildings. And by the later eras where we will make use of more plunder-able buildings, we will have enough Watchfires from events and Ritual Flames from GE, that we never need waste land on either a Deal Castle or a St. Basil. (I used to own both of these GBs, and I sold them both.)

  5. With any Storage Kits left, I would store as many Ritual Flames as I could, for the reasons discussed in #4 above.

  6. Sell all "Plunder Bait" Multi-production buildings: Terrace Farms, Bazaar, Aviary, and any others I forgot to mention. We will score many, many more of these in the later eras where they are more useful, even in an HQS city (PME and later). Using multi-production buildings, which all cost population and offsetting happiness to produce plunder-able FPs or goods is not as valuable as it might seem in an HQS city in CA or HMA. And these buildings are the very reason this city needs to devote any land to city defense bonus. This is especially true in an HQS city in Colonial Age and below, where by just increasing the total number of quests per day we can increase our daily production of goods and FPs very efficiently, and quest rewards cannot be plundered so we require no city defense. However, in PME and later, buildings like these will make more sense for discounted refined goods production, since we will usually need to produce goods conventionally again. But by the time we actually need these buildings, we will score many more of them, and they will locked to later eras when we score them.

  7. Keep: The Lord's Manor, Rogue Hideouts, Champion's Retreats, SOKs, and SOAs.

  8. Sell the Caravansary. The same land occupied with Alchemists will produce more total value.

  9. Sell all "Plunder Bait" Cherry Garden buildings and all "Plunder Bait" Garden Ruins buildings. We should never prioritize scoring these types of buildings in events. There are much better prizes to prioritize scoring in events, such as: SoKs, Renovation Kits, SoKs, Premium Cultural Buildings, SoKs, Premium Residential Buildings, SoKs, 1-Up Kits, SoKs, Storage Kits, SoKs, Tigers' Dens, SoKs, Rogue Hideouts, and SoKs.

  10. If it is my city we are talking about, I might consider selling the ToR in an HQS city in either HMA or CA. Since this city has so much total GB progress already, and also a bunch of progress on ToR specifically, this would be a tough call either way.

    On the whole, ToR not an efficient GB at all. I've said many times that ToR does not offer enough consistent value compared to other GBs, or compared to the value we can get from working HQS on the same amount land. Sure we can use ToR to score tons of relic. However about half of all relics are special buildings that we will never use in an HQS city in HMA or CA. We have a finite amount of land in our city.

    This might come as a shock, but I'm in the Future Era with a level 8 ToR; and every week I debate selling my Level 8 ToR! I now own pages and pages of special buildings in my Inventory that I will never use in my city. I have 40 Faces of the Ancient/Gates of the God in Inventory. I own 3 Terrace Farms now and I have 3 more in inventory. I own 9 Tribal Squares and have 5 more in Inventory. My city has 7 Wishing Wells and I just sold 4 Fountains of Youth in a remodel, and I own more Fountains in Inventory. So my ToR is only useful to me when I specifically score these relics:
    • 25 Goods (Silver)
    • 20 FPs (Silver)
    • 200 goods (Gold)
    • 100 FPs (Gold)
    • 10 Rogues (Gold)
    • Renovation Kit (Jade)
    • 1-Up Kit (Jade)
    • Storage Kit (Jade)


    I cannot really make use of any other relics in my city, unit I advance to a later era and need to score copies of special buildings lock to that era. I have a city full of special buildings that are as-good-as or better-than any of those I can score from ToR Relics.

  11. Sell any and all decorations.

  12. I do not like that this city has Dynamic Tower. This is a GB that I never recommend constructing until all other GBs are already level 10. Let me be very clear here, I would also never recommend selling a Dynamic Tower if a city already has it, since the steep construction price has already been paid, so might as well make use of it.

    Long story short, DT is not as efficient of a GB as many players believe it to be and I have detailed analysis as to why its a better move to avoid, or at least delay, chasing this GB. Yes the DT can eventually pay for itself; but the operative word here is "eventually", which means do not hold your breath while you are waiting.

    It's not that a player should never construct DT; it's more along the lines of the conditions need to be optimal to construct Dt and have it pay for itself. In a lower-age city, the DT is not efficient enough to pay back its construction goods, and also the value of the FPs required to level it up. But in a city that is in say CE or later, constructing a DT might make more sense, because that player can just trade his own period's goods for the TE goods required to construct DT, without spending any FPs for construction goods. The DT is very different from either the Arc or CF in this regard; both of the later GBs can pay for their own construction cost in a lower age such as HMA or CA, because both increase FPs scored. The analysis of DT is not as straight forward as for Arc or CF. A lower age player will have no players in their hood to score valuable goods from Aid clicks. So the value of owning a DT comes down to how many later era players are in the same Guild or on our Fiends List. And even with many later eras players, the DT is going to take a long time to pay off the same value as 1,875 TE goods.
 

DeletedUser23444

35 x "Produce Supplies"
by that do you mean the quest where you collect two 24h productions?


Click here to jump to the sectioned titled: Questing Explained In-Depth
  • Always Do Everything For Quest Credit!
  • The Different Types of Quests
  • Complete List of Recurring Quests
  • Random Quest Rewards
When you get to that section post, scroll down to the highlighted subsection, where I describe each and every recurring quest and I give an abbreviated name in parenthesis for each specific quest.
 

DeletedUser26965

well this is what I could gather through the verbosity and some math. I figure 200 goods a day is feasible but to get 600 would mean hitting the goods reward 60 times which seems highly unlikely but please feel free to correct this and if anyone can show differently please do so simply and succinctly.;

70 clockmakers
lvl 10 LoA
lvl 6 CF

601,020 supplies from clockmakers
172,000 supplies from 35 quest rewards
773020/30000=25 ubq's
110000 supplies from rewards
3 ubq's

35 quests from clockmakers, 28 ubq's = 63 quests
30% of 63 is 18.9
19x10=190 Goods

60 is 75% of 80
60 is 95% of 63

it's a 30% chance to get goods
 

Opozicija

New Member
Wow, you've been in HMA a long time! Make no mistake, you are as far from working HQS as you possibly can get in an HMA city. Since your city is so tricky, I'm not going to advise you on what you should do with your city. Instead, I'm going to say what I would do if that were my own city and make some other ocmments for the benefit of other players.

Taking into account what I know about how HQS works, here us what I would do with that city, if it were my city:
  1. Sell my sister and my mother to get up to Colonial Age ASAP so that I had a lot more land to work HQS on. This city is consuming so much land on GBs, most of which with many GB level, so the only way to get more land is to advance to CA. This would mean going "Full Tech Speed Ahead" (with the city as it is right now) until unlocking CA Clockmaking technology (skipping what techs can be skipped along the way). The next steps all would come after reaching CA.

  2. Store the Confectionery and Cider Mill to keep them for much later in the game (AFE or later), when we will use mainly special or premium supply production buildings to produce supplies.

  3. Store the Wishing Wells / Fountains or Youth for much later in the game (PME or later). These are much more valuable in PME and later. We don't use them in ME, because the HQS building in ME is the 3 x 3 Hatter. ME Wells / Fountains produce x2 CA goods (but we park in CA long time to produce CA goods). In contrast, 5 x ME Hatters can produce ME goods from quest rewards.

  4. Sell the StB. An HQS city requires 0% city defense bonus because we have no plunder-able buildings. And by the later eras where we will make use of more plunder-able buildings, we will have enough Watchfires from events and Ritual Flames from GE, that we never need waste land on either a Deal Castle or a St. Basil. (I used to own both of these GBs, and I sold them both.)

  5. With any Storage Kits left, I would store as many Ritual Flames as I could, for the reasons discussed in #4 above.

  6. Sell all "Plunder Bait" Multi-production buildings: Terrace Farms, Bazaar, Aviary, and any others I forgot to mention. We will score many, many more of these in the later eras where they are more useful, even in an HQS city (PME and later). Using multi-production buildings, which all cost population and offsetting happiness to produce plunder-able FPs or goods is not as valuable as it might seem in an HQS city in CA or HMA. And these buildings are the very reason this city needs to devote any land to city defense bonus. This is especially true in an HQS city in Colonial Age and below, where by just increasing the total number of quests per day we can increase our daily production of goods and FPs very efficiently, and quest rewards cannot be plundered so we require no city defense. However, in PME and later, buildings like these will make more sense for discounted refined goods production, since we will usually need to produce goods conventionally again. But by the time we actually need these buildings, we will score many more of them, and they will locked to later eras when we score them.

  7. Keep: The Lord's Manor, Rogue Hideouts, Champion's Retreats, SOKs, and SOAs.

  8. Sell the Caravansary. The same land occupied with Alchemists will produce more total value.

  9. Sell all "Plunder Bait" Cherry Garden buildings and all "Plunder Bait" Garden Ruins buildings. We should never prioritize scoring these types of buildings in events. There are much better prizes to prioritize scoring in events, such as: SoKs, Renovation Kits, SoKs, Premium Cultural Buildings, SoKs, Premium Residential Buildings, SoKs, 1-Up Kits, SoKs, Storage Kits, SoKs, Tigers' Dens, SoKs, Rogue Hideouts, and SoKs.

  10. If it is my city we are talking about, I might consider selling the ToR in an HQS city in either HMA or CA. Since this city has so much total GB progress already, and also a bunch of progress on ToR specifically, this would be a tough call either way.

    On the whole, ToR not an efficient GB at all. I've said many times that ToR does not offer enough consistent value compared to other GBs, or compared to the value we can get from working HQS on the same amount land. Sure we can use ToR to score tons of relic. However about half of all relics are special buildings that we will never use in an HQS city in HMA or CA. We have a finite amount of land in our city.

    This might come as a shock, but I'm in the Future Era with a level 8 ToR; and every week I debate selling my Level 8 ToR! I now own pages and pages of special buildings in my Inventory that I will never use in my city. I have 40 Faces of the Ancient/Gates of the God in Inventory. I own 3 Terrace Farms now and I have 3 more in inventory. I own 9 Tribal Squares and have 5 more in Inventory. My city has 7 Wishing Wells and I just sold 4 Fountains of Youth in a remodel, and I own more Fountains in Inventory. So my ToR is only useful to me when I specifically score these relics:
    • 25 Goods (Silver)
    • 20 FPs (Silver)
    • 200 goods (Gold)
    • 100 FPs (Gold)
    • 10 Rogues (Gold)
    • Renovation Kit (Jade)
    • 1-Up Kit (Jade)
    • Storage Kit (Jade)


    I cannot really make use of any other relics in my city, unit I advance to a later era and need to score copies of special buildings lock to that era. I have a city full of special buildings that are as-good-as or better-than any of those I can score from ToR Relics.

  11. Sell any and all decorations.

  12. I do not like that this city has Dynamic Tower. This is a GB that I never recommend constructing until all other GBs are already level 10. Let me be very clear here, I would also never recommend selling a Dynamic Tower if a city already has it, since the steep construction price has already been paid, so might as well make use of it.

    Long story short, DT is not as efficient of a GB as many players believe it to be and I have detailed analysis as to why its a better move to avoid, or at least delay, chasing this GB. Yes the DT can eventually pay for itself; but the operative word here is "eventually", which means do not hold your breath while you are waiting.

    It's not that a player should never construct DT; it's more along the lines of the conditions need to be optimal to construct Dt and have it pay for itself. In a lower-age city, the DT is not efficient enough to pay back its construction goods, and also the value of the FPs required to level it up. But in a city that is in say CE or later, constructing a DT might make more sense, because that player can just trade his own period's goods for the TE goods required to construct DT, without spending any FPs for construction goods. The DT is very different from either the Arc or CF in this regard; both of the later GBs can pay for their own construction cost in a lower age such as HMA or CA, because both increase FPs scored. The analysis of DT is not as straight forward as for Arc or CF. A lower age player will have no players in their hood to score valuable goods from Aid clicks. So the value of owning a DT comes down to how many later era players are in the same Guild or on our Fiends List. And even with many later eras players, the DT is going to take a long time to pay off the same value as 1,875 TE goods.

Despite my self coaching it seems to me that I havent completely screw up city in 10 months and there is chance to fix things in CA..I am quite happy with your advice..:) I just wonder how would my city look like if I have done it on your way..

But, I have one important question. After redesign I will lose 28 FPs per day (neglect other benefits which are minor problem), (terraces(15),cherry set(5), ruin garden(2), bazaars(4),aviary(2)), do you really think that doing quests will compensate that? Because I am also using this points to do rec.quests and also those points should be somehow multiple because I have Arc and those points are returning to me as FP profit (rewards from contributing to other GBs and also my GBs are being leveled faster). Its not at all that I am trying to prove that concept is wrong, I am just asking if its worth it in this specific case? I believe a lot of us who would like to switch on HQS city has that issue to clear.

I am asking also because I have 4 swap partners (300 FPs/week, 150 FPs/week, 100FPs/week, 35 FPs/week = 585 FPs/week). At this moment I am producing (87×7=609 FPs/week). When I reduce those 28 FPs/day my week production is (59×7=413 FPs/week). So difference is 609-413 = 196 less FPs/week and 585 (points I need for swaping)-413=172 FPs/week which I need to create to maintain current situation.

I hope I made clear what bothers me. I have no problem at all to sell everything you sad and to adopt but I want to be sure that math will work when I do it..
TIA ;)
 

DeletedUser23444

well this is what I could gather through the verbosity and some math. I figure 200 goods a day is feasible but to get 600 would mean hitting the goods reward 60 times

Yeah sorry, but a few things I didn't point out earlier (Sorry but when you work on as many things at once and you are going 90 miles an hour trying to answer everyone, you lose some things).

  • I did not point out that the 600 goods did in fact contains goods produced from GBs. I usually just recorded how much revenue my entire city produced per day as far as good went.

  • This city plan I posted earlier was my final city plan for CA. But it might not have been the plan in place when I score the 600 goods. So while that city at 70 Clockmakers, other variations might have had far more.

  • Also the number or quests I used in the math break down, was to show how the GBs impacted the strategy. The fact is that those number of quests are a normal questing cycle. But on some days (coins stockpiles permitting) I would do what I called: "a heavy questing day", where I completed far more UBQs than just 1 of them for each 1 "Produce Supplies" quest.
This is why the guide mentions that the Heavy Questing Strategy is designed around the UBQ, not the "Produce Supplies" quest. Given the right city design and GB levels, we can easily add more quests per day, by just spamming more UBQs. For example, I currently only run 40 Levitation Outlets in the Future Era, which completes 7 x "Produce Supplies" quests. And if I completed 1 UBQ during each abort-cycle, that would be 7 UBQs. But there are many days where I will spam as many as 50 UBQs, especially when I want to complete the final Umpteen Thousand medals of my next Victory Expansion, or I really need some more FE goods quickly.

So when I list a city and I say it can complete X number of quests, that is the numbers for only completing 1 UBQ for each "Produce Supplies". But take that more as the floor and not the ceiling. We can spam as many UBQs as we can afford. Thus the goal is to design our city to be able to afford as many UBQs as possible, given the same amount of land.
 
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