• We are looking for you!
    Always wanted to join our Supporting Team? We are looking for enthusiastic moderators!
    Take a look at our recruitement page for more information and how you can apply:
    Apply

Feedback for The Galata Tower!

Graviton

Well-Known Member
Theft is theft- condoning it is wrong
When it comes to FoE, this attitude is wrong. Plundering is theft, yes it is. But in the context of this game, it is perfectly and morally acceptable. It's part of the basic game design. Working as intended. Just like stealing a base in a baseball game. Better that you put your energy toward accepting that and exploiting the rules of the game to mitigate being plundered, instead of railing against the way things are.
 

Kranyar the Mysterious

Well-Known Member
When it comes to FoE, this attitude is wrong. Plundering is theft, yes it is. But in the context of this game, it is perfectly and morally acceptable. It's part of the basic game design. Working as intended. Just like stealing a base in a baseball game. Better that you put your energy toward accepting that and exploiting the rules of the game to mitigate being plundered, instead of railing against the way things are.
And not only that, but there are game mechanics and great buildings that require a player to attack and plunder if they are to properly use the game's mechanics.
 

Deleted member 51741

The Galata Tower has completely ruined the game for plunderers while at the same time making other GBs like Atlantis Museum, Voyager V1, St. Basils and Deal Castle even more worthless than they were before. As someone who has been plundering over the past 2 years in Future Era, I think it is fair to say that 75% of the time that I defeat a defending army, there is nothing even available to plunder. The other 25% of the time, we are usually talking about a 1fp building or a terrace farm/plunderable event building if I'm lucky (5-10% of the time). Now with the Galata Tower showing up in more and more cities, I find that if I am able to (1) defeat a defending army and (2) find something worth plundering, I am maybe getting something worthwhile like 5% of the time - all because of this tiny 3x3 Galta Tower. With this being the case, I find it nearly impossible to justify owning a 6x7 tile Atlantis Museum to give you some unrefined goods or a 4x7 V1 Voyager to give you supplies (LOL). The defense boosts from a 5x5 St. Basils and 6x7 Deal Castle usually pale in compaison against a strong attacking army, so even less of a reason to need those if the Galata Tower saves you half the time, unless you care THAT much about GvG support pool? which nobody seems to care about GvG anymore (as a mobile player I could care less). You think Inno would just want people to play the game and collect on time, instead of giving them a cop out GB with the Galata Tower?

I honestly do not understand how Inno just introduced this GB without looking at how it was going to impact the game and other GBs. They themselves are the kings of plundering diamonds from players during the events, falsely making you think you can ever get those daily specials that you really want...they may tell you 10-13% chance, but over and over again I seem to find myself in statistically impossible situations if the odds they claim are true. Anyways, sorry for the side rant...in closing, something really needs to be done...either severely nerf the Galta Tower boost (for God's sake the impact it's making is riduculous for only being a 3x3 building), or offer up something better boosts from the other 4 mentioned GBs (maybe ignore Galata Tower impact if you have Atlantis Museum or V1 Voyager?).
 

Algona

Well-Known Member
I honestly do not understand how Inno just introduced this GB
Maybe ask INNO? Or other players what they think? You could read the Official Feedback thread on Galata Tower for some ideas?

I seem to find myself in statistically impossible situations
In 6 years of reading pretty much every post on this forum I've never seen a person make this statement then back it up with a meaningful data sample or demonstrate any indication that the poster had significant understanding of probability and statistics.

Possibly you'll be the first to do otherwise.

As far as your thread title, how much of your game play and game state advancement revolves around plundering versus GBG, GvG, Great Building power leveling, RQ fatming and other such activities?
 

Deleted member 51741

In 6 years of reading pretty much every post on this forum I've never seen a person make this statement then back it up with a meaningful data sample or demonstrate any indication that the poster had significant understanding of probability and statistics.
Lucky for you I am a metrology process engineer by profession, where my job requires me to understand a thing or two about sample size, statistics and probability - so I have taken the time in past events to run the numbers where I've felt cheated by the Inno odds, but obviously I haven't been saving all that data somewhere so I could someday prove it. Often times in these events, I am saving all of my "event tokens" (ie. lanterns, florins) for use on one day and one special, usually towards the end of the event, so the sample size is usually meaningful. I actually did find a ticket I wrote from the 2019 Carnival Even, which was particularly bad, having spent ~6000 consecutive florins opening cases that only offered >10% chance at the special, and getting 0 out of 25+ trys -- not a great sample size, but odds of losing 25 consecutive times with 10% odds are roughly 7%....or recently going for the cherry garden sets yesterday - having used roughly 5500 lanterns to only win 2 specials, only making jumps thats had 10% chance or greater and cost between 80 and 113 (or about about 57 total jumps - as big as a sample size you are going to get from the average player), equates 3.5% odds. Would those odds go up with a bigger sample size? Maybe, we don't really know, we are just taking Innos word for it as nobody can feasibly spend enough diamonds or pool enough data to make a conclusion otherwise- AND INNO KNOWS THIS. If you are trusting enough to take their word for it (when they make their revenue from diamond sales) then you sir are either (1) a fool or (2) working for Inno.


In regards to it ruining the game, sure it's an exaggeration, but I stand by what I said. As someone who spends a few hours a day playing, I treat plundering hoodies as I would aiding friends and guildies. Plundering used to be a profitable venture, now a waste of time, as well as the FPs spent for anyone leveling those GBs that I mentioned before. Sure there are other aspects to the game, and I could go on about how those are flawed too. The fact that they completely ruined plundering and made 4 larger GBs worthless with one 3x3 GB just seems like a big deal to me. I'm sure most people are going to disagree because they enjoy the protection of the Galata Tower, not needing to collect on time, or are sick of getting plundered, don't have the plunder boosting GBs (they are not the most common), or are too weak to plunder others (yes I'm talking about at you players who advance frivolously through the ages and somehow show up in my future era hood with less than 1M points - you brought this upon yourself)...
 
Last edited by a moderator:

RazorbackPirate

Well-Known Member
Lucky for you I am a metrology process engineer by profession, where my job requires me to understand a thing or two about sample size, statistics and probability - more so than Algona the well-known member...I have taken the time in past events to run the numbers where I've felt cheated by the Inno odds, but obviously I haven't been saving all that data somewhere so I could someday prove it to Algona the well-known member... Often times in these events, I am saving all of my "event tokens" (ie. lanterns, florins) for use on one day and one special, usually towards the end of the event, so the sample size is usually meaningful. I actually did find a ticket I wrote from the 2019 Carnival Even, which was particularly bad, having spent ~6000 consecutive florins opening cases that only offered >10% chance at the special, and getting 0 out of 25+ trys -- not a great sample size, but odds of losing 25 consecutive times with 10% odds are roughly 7%....or recently going for the cherry garden sets yesterday - having used roughly 5500 lanterns to only win 2 specials, only making jumps thats had 10% chance or greater and cost between 80 and 113 (or about about 57 total jumps - as big as a sample size you are going to get from the average player), equates 3.5% odds. Would those odds go up with a bigger sample size? Maybe, we don't really know, we are just taking Innos word for it as nobody can feasibly spend enough diamonds or pool enough data to make a conclusion otherwise- AND INNO KNOWS THIS. If you are trusting enough to take their word for it (when they make their revenue from diamond sales) then you sir are either (1) a fool or (2) working for Inno.
As a metrology process engineer, where are you cutting corners, fudging the numbers or otherwise cheating your customers? Your company makes revenue from somewhere, right? Seems I'd have to be a fool or working with you to think otherwise.

Once again, prove it. I don't want to hear about events and sample sizes, and that time at band camp when the RNG broke in the wrong way. You want to prove Inno is cheating? Do it. You now have an unlimited sample size. Just like @Algona the well-known member did when he gathered the data collecting his Wishing Wells 10,000 times, documenting his results in a thread here on the forum.

You up for that? Seems you ought to know who you're talking about or to, Mr. Metrology Process Engineer. You measure for a living, go measure. Come back when you have something.

Plunder away and document every result from every plunder attempt. 10,000 samples should do it, don't you think Mr. measurement guy? Show us your expertise. If anyone can prove Inno cheats their customers like you cheat yours, it's you. I know it is.
In regards to it ruining the game, sure it's an exaggeration, but I stand by what I said. As someone who spends a few hours a day playing, I treat plundering hoodies as I would aiding friends and guildies. Plundering used to be a profitable venture, now a waste of time, as well as the FPs spent for anyone leveling those GBs that I mentioned before. Sure there are other aspects to the game, and I could go on about how those are flawed too. The fact that they completely ruined plundering and made 4 larger GBs worthless with one 3x3 GB just seems like a big deal to me. I'm sure most people are going to disagree because they enjoy the protection of the Galata Tower, not needing to collect on time, or are sick of getting plundered, don't have the plunder boosting GBs (they are not the most common), or are too weak to plunder others (yes I'm talking about at you players who advance frivolously through the ages and somehow show up in my future era hood with less than 1M points - you brought this upon yourself)...
Please go on about how the other areas of the game are flawed. Dazzle us with your expertise. All while you, Mr. Measurement Guy, prove statistically all the cheating by Inno every step of the way. By the time you're done, the EU will be handing you the company. Then we'll really have a game to play.
 
Last edited:

Emberguard

Well-Known Member
but over and over again I seem to find myself in statistically impossible situations if the odds they claim are true.
odds of losing 25 consecutive times with 10% odds are roughly 7%
Are you calling 7% a impossible situation? Himeji pays out diamonds at 1% (after a successful random chance), Crows Nest pays out at 5%. If 7% is impossible then anything below that is even more impossible

You got 6,000 florins as a bad run. Ok, I can sympathise with that. But I don't find it impossible. During that same event I bought diamonds to obtain roughly in the region of 300,000 florins and my absolute worst run was 10k+ florins. But despite that single outlier result, when taking all the results in their entirety I still acquired the amount of Daily Specials I was roughly expecting to get when doing math on the %'s shown. I'm not convinced there's anything wrong with the percentages. I've never found any evidence to substantiate any claims that it's not working the way it should, I've only found evidence to substantiate the percentages are what they're advertised to be.

The fact that they completely ruined plundering and made 4 larger GBs worthless with one 3x3 GB just seems like a big deal to me. I'm sure most people are going to disagree because they enjoy the protection of the Galata Tower
As a player I agree with you on that point. Introducing anything that protects post battle is going to impact the value of anything for the actual battle or in plundering. I'd have preferred if the actual defending army were improved rather then more post battle protection.
 

Algona

Well-Known Member
Lucky for you I am a metrology process engineer by profession
You took the time to register for the forums, you felt you had something important to share, then why not use the same professional standards to make that point?

I'm sure you don't present baseless anecdotes, unsupported caveat ridden phrases such as 'i think it is fair to say', 'we (who is we?) are usually talking about'. 'I am maybe getting', exaggerations, and unfocused statements when discussing anything regarding your work.

Ain't rightly sure why you are upset with me, I'm not the one who chose to skimp on the professionalism.

You either have data or not, you either present it or not, you either discuss your analysis of the data or not.

So far your posts are all notted up.

sure it's an exaggeration
Why exaggerate? This well known member* (your emphasis, not mine) has seen people use exaggeration repeatedly. Much like 'statistically impossible' indicates lack of understanding statistics, exaggerations like 'ruined the game' indicate the poster is not confident in their own argument.

I don't claim to be smart, rather the opposite, I'm kinda slow mentally.

It's taken me years and reading thousands of posts for me to see patterns in posts like the indications behind 'statistically impossible', 'ruined the game', and others commonly used like 'unfair' and 'impossible' and 'cheat' and other signposts that say a lot about the poster using them and very little that applies to their topic.

As I said in my first response to you, possibly you'll be the first to be different. I suspect I'm wrong in that again.



*Forum titles are not self applied. They are automatically applied by the forum software and are based solely on post count and signify nothing else.
 

Rogue Master MJ

Well-Known Member
I plunder two hoods on two worlds daily. Still in Iron Age on both so hoods are a mix of EMA & IA.
My observations to date on the GT...
1.) It works sometimes... I would say about as advertised.
2.) Most players at these ages haven't bothered to build it, might be why they increased requirements...
3.) Has not changed my ruthless evil behavior one little bit... But I attack daily regardless, just for the battles and the fun of it.
4.) I built one, mainly for the goods, the size and the irony. :p
 

Deleted member 51741

You took the time to register for the forums, you felt you had something important to share, then why not use the same professional standards to make that point?

I'm sure you don't present baseless anecdotes, unsupported caveat ridden phrases such as 'i think it is fair to say', 'we (who is we?) are usually talking about'. 'I am maybe getting', exaggerations, and unfocused statements when discussing anything regarding your work.

Ain't rightly sure why you are upset with me, I'm not the one who chose to skimp on the professionalism.

You either have data or not, you either present it or not, you either discuss your analysis of the data or not.

So far your posts are all notted up.



Why exaggerate? This well known member* (your emphasis, not mine) has seen people use exaggeration repeatedly. Much like 'statistically impossible' indicates lack of understanding statistics, exaggerations like 'ruined the game' indicate the poster is not confident in their own argument.

I don't claim to be smart, rather the opposite, I'm kinda slow mentally.

It's taken me years and reading thousands of posts for me to see patterns in posts like the indications behind 'statistically impossible', 'ruined the game', and others commonly used like 'unfair' and 'impossible' and 'cheat' and other signposts that say a lot about the poster using them and very little that applies to their topic.

As I said in my first response to you, possibly you'll be the first to be different. I suspect I'm wrong in that again.



*Forum titles are not self applied. They are automatically applied by the forum software and are based solely on post count and signify nothing else.
My post was about Galata Tower. I wrote a lengthy paragraph citing my reasons why I felt that the Galata Tower has caused big issues with the game. Instead of responding to this, you chose to focus on ONE LINE where I took a shot at Inno, and then make a presumptuous claim that I likely have no understanding about statistics...yet I am the one who is acting unprofessional. If this is what this forum is all about, then I won't waste my time.
 

Algona

Well-Known Member
Instead of responding to this
I did respond. I ridiculed your notions that

ranting instead of asking questions is an effective way to garner explanations or information,

anything you described was statistically impossible,

you felt the need to put a massively exaggerated title on the thread you created.

What else is there to respond to in that post?

I got you don't like Galata. I'm not one to dispute your personal likes and dislikes.

There's nothing else of substance in that post to disagree with. There's no point in arguing over a bunch of anecdotal stories, made up percentages, and allusions to topics having nothing to do with Galata.

yet I am the one who is acting unprofessional
I invite you to review your responses to RP.

You're the one who brought your profession into this. Since you donlt know what I do for a living, questioning my professionalism seems a bit specious.
If this is what this forum is all about, then I won't waste my time.
Heh. Speaking of a lack of statistically meaningful sample sizes...

You're judging a forum of thousands of threads and tens of thousands of posts based on a sample size of less then a dozen posts.

[devil's advocate]

If by 'this is what this forum is all about' you mean some posters not accepting baseless rants as facts then you are spot on.

[/devil's advocate]
 

Johnny B. Goode

Well-Known Member
Lucky for you I am a metrology process engineer by profession, where my job requires me to understand a thing or two about sample size, statistics and probability - so I have taken the time in past events to run the numbers where I've felt cheated by the Inno odds, but obviously I haven't been saving all that data somewhere so I could someday prove it.
If you were "a professional", then you would have saved the numbers you "ran". Otherwise, why run them? We weren't born yesterday, my friend,
Often times in these events, I am saving all of my "event tokens" (ie. lanterns, florins) for use on one day and one special, usually towards the end of the event, so the sample size is usually meaningful.
Ummm...no, your sample size is not meaningful. Even if you saved all your event currency for the last day, that is a drop in the proverbial bucket to the thousands and thousands of samples from all the players participating to some degree in the event.
5500 lanterns to only win 2 specials, only making jumps thats had 10% chance or greater and cost between 80 and 113 (or about about 57 total jumps - as big as a sample size you are going to get from the average player),
And there are hundreds of thousands of players, so the "sample size" from one player is basically meaningless. Unless you actually don't understand probability at all, which is more likely.
Would those odds go up with a bigger sample size? Maybe, we don't really know, we are just taking Innos word for it as nobody can feasibly spend enough diamonds or pool enough data to make a conclusion otherwise- AND INNO KNOWS THIS. If you are trusting enough to take their word for it (when they make their revenue from diamond sales) then you sir are either (1) a fool or (2) working for Inno.
So start a city on every one of the 27 U.S. worlds and get a bigger sample size. Although that would still be 27 out of thousands, so...
Until you have PROOF that the RNG is not what Inno says, I would suggest that you stop making unfounded accusations of dishonesty. Technically, what you're engaging in is slander...or libel, I never could keep them straight.
then you sir are either (1) a fool or (2) working for Inno.
Okay, I'm pretty sure this would be slander...if anyone cared about your opinion. LOL
I treat plundering hoodies as I would aiding friends and guildies. Plundering used to be a profitable venture, now a waste of time, as well as the FPs spent for anyone leveling those GBs that I mentioned before. Sure there are other aspects to the game, and I could go on about how those are flawed too. The fact that they completely ruined plundering and made 4 larger GBs worthless with one 3x3 GB just seems like a big deal to me. I'm sure most people are going to disagree because they enjoy the protection of the Galata Tower, not needing to collect on time, or are sick of getting plundered, don't have the plunder boosting GBs (they are not the most common), or are too weak to plunder others (yes I'm talking about at you players who advance frivolously through the ages and somehow show up in my future era hood with less than 1M points - you brought this upon yourself)...
There is so much wrong with this portion that I will just address what does not apply to me.
A) I don't disagree because I "enjoy the protection" of the Galata Tower. I have not yet built it in any of my 27 cities.
B) I don't care about collecting on time because plundering of my cities is less than meaningless to me.
C) I am not "sick of being plundered", I am beyond even caring if I get plundered.
D) No, I don't have the "plunder boosting GBs" on most worlds, but that is irrelevant to me. I would feel the same whether I had them or not.
E) I am definitely not too weak to plunder others...just too lazy most of the time.
F) If I showed up in your FE hood, you had better have a Galata Tower. Bwahahahaha!
 

Deleted member 51741

I work for Inno.
Thank you for making this clear.

Still not sure why everyone is so up in arms over this. I just wanted to talk Galata Tower. Seems like everyone else is still hurt and so eager to defend Inno over my 1 liner dig at the odds generator...
 
Last edited by a moderator:

RazorbackPirate

Well-Known Member
Thank you for making this clear.

Still not sure why everyone is so up in arms over this. I just wanted to talk Galata Tower. Seems like everyone else is still hurt and so eager to defend Inno over my 1 liner dig at the odds generator...
@Johnny B. Goode does not work for Inno, although he used to be a Mod on the forum, that's a volunteer position. Now, of course, I work for Inno. I measure stuff for them.

No hurt, just calling you out for being the last in a long line of players who come here to accuse Inno of cheating, provides no proof, and calls everyone a fool for thinking Inno runs an honest company because they make money. Then when challenged to provide the numbers to back your accusations, you whip out your... edjumucayshun as proof. Completely laughable given your claimed expertise. Mr. Measure Man didn't measure squat.

When challenged to actually measure and show that claimed expertise? Butt hurt and slander about mental illness, and we must all work for Inno. Clown world.
 

Deleted member 51741

@Johnny B. Goode does not work for Inno, although he used to be a Mod on the forum, that's a volunteer position. Now, of course, I work for Inno. I measure stuff for them.

No hurt, just calling you out for being the last in a long line of players who come here to accuse Inno of cheating, provides no proof, and calls everyone a fool for thinking Inno runs an honest company because they make money. Then when challenged to provide the numbers to back your accusations, you whip out your... edjumucayshun as proof. Completely laughable given your claimed expertise. Mr. Measure Man didn't measure squat.

When challenged to actually measure and show that claimed expertise? Butt hurt and slander about mental illness, and we must all work for Inno. Clown world.
Go look at sample sizes in any FDA study. They sure as hell aren't sampling millions of people, maybe a few hundred or thousand, yet their drugs, etc are approved for the entire US public - 330 million people. Look at the moderna vaccine; they tested on 28,000 people and now it's being shot into the arms of millions of people. There's a reason they leave the statistics up to people with the degrees, otherwise we'd have Razorback pirate and johnny b goode going around trying to tally millions of numbers to come to the same conclusion you can deduct from a smaller sample size. Better go tell the FDA how dumb they are too while you're at it!
 

Algona

Well-Known Member
Why wasn't your sample size on the order of that amount?

You have to know what the sample size would be to reliably support your position.

You didn't get anywhere near it.

Thank you for making this clear.

Still not sure why everyone is so up in arms over this. I just wanted to talk Galata Tower. Seems like everyone else is still butthurt and so eager to defend Inno over my 1 liner dig at the odds generator...
No, JBG used to volunteer for INNO. He quit.

It's not everyone, it's just 5 of 6 people who have posted. Keep your eye on the sixth, I'll get back to them.

Folk don't need to be paid to disagree with posters of your ilk, that disagreement naturally happens on forums. For a while.

If you continue in your current vein you will notice that fewer folk will respond over time.

Folks who are here for serious reasons eventually tire of your kind and eventually start ignoring you, because you will demonstrate you have nothing of value to contribute.

Your opinions and posts will be dismissed out of hand.

Case in point, you forgot or ignored (remember your remark about everyone up in arms?) that another poster agreed with one of your quips.

That's your future: Even posters of your own ilk will ignore and forget your posts. Eventually you'll get tired of being ignored and wander off.

----------

I admit to the personal fault that I take great enjoyment out of telling folk like you exactly what is happening and will happen and not be believed and then watch it happen.