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Feedback for the new Guild Expedition Trials!
- Thread starter LeCron
- Start date
Sharmon the Impaler
Well-Known Member
It looks interesting but very sparse on details. Will the tiny Fountain of Youth upgrade a level 1 or will you need a FoY , a shrink kit and then a tiny shrink kit for the full effect ?
xivarmy
Well-Known Member
The latter.
e2m2
Member
The link to Knowledge Base in the announcement is outdated, I think. It links to the old Beta Knowledge Base which says that only Trials 1-3 will be unlocked on Day 1.
This is the correct link which was posted on Discord which says Trials 1-8 will be unlocked on Day 1:
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JWJWB
Member
Oh. Was that what that mini challenge was for? I never pay attention to the dialogue, I just do the quests.
Anyways. My feedback. I am looking forward to this update. However, there are two things that I am complaining about. One is pretty obvious. The diamonds were reduced. I know it isn't that big of a deal and it was also inevitable, but for a F2P player, GE was my second main source of diamonds (After GbG.)
One more thing I am complaining about is the terrace farms. The silver and gold levels are great, and the size decreases, but to get that size decrease, you need to find space for the beginning level. And for some people there isn't that much space. You could use a store building to find that space, but I (personally) find it a little redundant to store something and immediatley put it back when you are done with whatever you are doing. Same thing with the FoY, but on a smaller scale.
Anyways. My feedback. I am looking forward to this update. However, there are two things that I am complaining about. One is pretty obvious. The diamonds were reduced. I know it isn't that big of a deal and it was also inevitable, but for a F2P player, GE was my second main source of diamonds (After GbG.)
One more thing I am complaining about is the terrace farms. The silver and gold levels are great, and the size decreases, but to get that size decrease, you need to find space for the beginning level. And for some people there isn't that much space. You could use a store building to find that space, but I (personally) find it a little redundant to store something and immediatley put it back when you are done with whatever you are doing. Same thing with the FoY, but on a smaller scale.
Xenosaur
Well-Known Member
That's the big question. Some opine that the answer is "no point to do so, do the minimum, get the max or "equality" to old GE for value".
Other say, to test the waters for how strong they are, so the "king of the hill" approach. Some might want something special Inno cooked up for GE II - 2nd shrink kit to produce a 2x2 reduced size FoY, or reduced size Terrace Farm on steroids, or new serpent stuff.
There is no consistent answer. It's now much more of a personal journey with personal achievements, so you get decide what you pick for TRIAL level, and reason.
To that end, even though it's MONDAY - RIGHT NOW - go into GE - you can hover on each TRIAL level up to 30 - and see the entire lineup of rewards you can win, in all 80 encounters of that trial. Go study a few trial levels over the course of your GE planned progress.
Start your thinking now - so as early as tomorrow when GE opens in the new format, you have your thoughts all worked out.
The concept of the WEEKLY GUILD winner (GOLD CUP) from multiple worlds lost a lot of it's luster, if it had much to begin with.
There is no value to the gold cup much anymore, other than bragging rights that no one really cares about.
So we're back to: What YOU can get from GE, individually, vs what the guild earns collectively for a placement win.
BE CAREFUL THOUGH - What's very hidden from view, is the guild cost when someone vaults way way up the TRIAL range. If the guild treasury is light (thin) on goods in some eras, it could impact the guild, but each case needs to be studied carefully before it's dismissed - imperiously or not. If most people are staying in 5, and one cowboy (or cowgirl) goes to 11 or 12, it has sizable implications for cost.
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KeithOfTheForge
Well-Known Member
A little surprised to see this coming to live so quickly. The rewards just don't seem good enough for all the extra effort though.
e2m2
Member
You get silver and golden upgrades for Serpent and Terrace Farm in higher Trials. Whether that's worth the extra hassle, I don't know. Some people just like to be challenged, and that's OK.
Xenosaur
Well-Known Member
@KeithOfTheForge - I think that after the energy of the effort to get Inno to go back to the drawing board on the first version beta players of GE II saw, there was a collective sigh of relief they "fixed" the beta community's major pushback issues on scaled difficulty, and the benchmark for base scaling. Then, with that fix, the GE II feedback topics lost a lot of their vocal fire, and it got quiet enough that Inno could get this into live release.
It really boils down to the FT - the first version of GE II would have excluded huge swaths of players in TRIAL 3 of the original design. Now with the curve smoothed and with Inno reviewing a new approach, FT fragments can be obtained in ALL TRIAL levels below 5. SO this is what you have now:
TRIAL 1 = 10 FT frags
TRIAL 2 = 20 FT frags
TRIAL 3 = 30 FT frags
TRIAL 4 = 40 FT frags
--> TRIAL 5 - 30 = 50 FT frags (as best we know about those ultra high TRIAL levels).
50 frags is the OLD GE difficulty level 5 (all BLUE warriors) total FT frag rewards/week - so if you just do TRIAL 5 - all 5 difficulty level (meaning 80 encounters, total), you're obtaining what most people want/need/have to have each week, and what they've been used to for the last few years since GE 5 was introduced.
TRIAL 5 is a little harder than "old GE", but most people can tackle it without an issue. Guess we're going to find out, right?
It really boils down to the FT - the first version of GE II would have excluded huge swaths of players in TRIAL 3 of the original design. Now with the curve smoothed and with Inno reviewing a new approach, FT fragments can be obtained in ALL TRIAL levels below 5. SO this is what you have now:
TRIAL 1 = 10 FT frags
TRIAL 2 = 20 FT frags
TRIAL 3 = 30 FT frags
TRIAL 4 = 40 FT frags
--> TRIAL 5 - 30 = 50 FT frags (as best we know about those ultra high TRIAL levels).
50 frags is the OLD GE difficulty level 5 (all BLUE warriors) total FT frag rewards/week - so if you just do TRIAL 5 - all 5 difficulty level (meaning 80 encounters, total), you're obtaining what most people want/need/have to have each week, and what they've been used to for the last few years since GE 5 was introduced.
TRIAL 5 is a little harder than "old GE", but most people can tackle it without an issue. Guess we're going to find out, right?
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Emyrs the Kind
Member
it looks like the only decent upgrade is the Terris farm ones at level 19 plus but it will take over a year with that low amount up frags per week to get 1 upgrade for me 18 isw about the best i could consivable do. Also the drop diamond rewards by like 90 percent again,
Xenosaur
Well-Known Member
@Emyrs the Kind - both valid points.
1) Fewer diamonds in GE II (to the best of my knowledge - I didn't study all the higher TRIALS in that much detail)
2) "decent upgrade", hmmm. Terrace Farms are conceptually resurrected (classic FoE product...) but now downsized from 30 squares of space, to at best 12. I'm not sure they're going to be finding a way into my city, @ 12 squares, for what they do. But, to each his/her own. Like all new Inno products, you're right - drip, drip, drip, and wait, wait, wait.
I'm not holding my breath but can the Shrine of Knowledge be that far behind? 1 square, 5 FP, 50 goods, and 25% Red/Blue attack powerhouse (just kidding, but who knows?)
1) Fewer diamonds in GE II (to the best of my knowledge - I didn't study all the higher TRIALS in that much detail)
2) "decent upgrade", hmmm. Terrace Farms are conceptually resurrected (classic FoE product...) but now downsized from 30 squares of space, to at best 12. I'm not sure they're going to be finding a way into my city, @ 12 squares, for what they do. But, to each his/her own. Like all new Inno products, you're right - drip, drip, drip, and wait, wait, wait.
I'm not holding my breath but can the Shrine of Knowledge be that far behind? 1 square, 5 FP, 50 goods, and 25% Red/Blue attack powerhouse (just kidding, but who knows?)
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xivarmy
Well-Known Member
Neo QI reward?
They still have more historical buildings to Neo though.e2m2
Member
Size aside, there is quite a bit of difference between old Terrace Farm Level 2 and the new Gold Terrace Farm. It's not bad by today's standards. But I'm sure in a year's time, after you collect all the fragments, it'll be outdated again.
This is in CA :
McBluefire
Active Member
It's gonna be nice leaving GE in my rear view mirror. It's really too bad all this effort is going into revamping a system that needed no revamp and all that's being added to it is more cost and junk rewards.
That new TF isn't worth the increased weekly cost of goods to your guild, the new serpent trains are ridiculous. The fact that you will still get ~50 Forgotten Temple frags every week no matter what trial you do makes no sense.
The entire update is just to increase guild costs, reduce diamonds awarded, and create a new reason to kick or deny admittance to a guild for a member who went silly and unlocked all the Trials. Makes no sense to have unlock costs tied to something that only a member controls and then give the member no way to reduce their own cost over time even if they stop doing GE permanently the guild they house is on the hook to cover the costs.
Our guild will still unlock all 5 levels every week and have no max trial officially set. If there was some compelling reason to go past Trial 5 this revamp might make sense, but as it stands it has no business going to the live servers. GE didn't need ANYTHING done to it.
That new TF isn't worth the increased weekly cost of goods to your guild, the new serpent trains are ridiculous. The fact that you will still get ~50 Forgotten Temple frags every week no matter what trial you do makes no sense.
- This Tuesday your guild will pay 3x more to unlock than it did last week.
- Next Tuesday your guild will pay around 4x more to unlock than it did two weeks ago
- The following Tuesdays your guild's cost to unlock GE will be totally at the mercy of how far members want to unlock trials. Yes, you pay for UNLOCKED trials, not COMPLETED trials, so always +3 trials than what was done! Sweetness, right?
The entire update is just to increase guild costs, reduce diamonds awarded, and create a new reason to kick or deny admittance to a guild for a member who went silly and unlocked all the Trials. Makes no sense to have unlock costs tied to something that only a member controls and then give the member no way to reduce their own cost over time even if they stop doing GE permanently the guild they house is on the hook to cover the costs.
Our guild will still unlock all 5 levels every week and have no max trial officially set. If there was some compelling reason to go past Trial 5 this revamp might make sense, but as it stands it has no business going to the live servers. GE didn't need ANYTHING done to it.
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Xenosaur
Well-Known Member
It's not bad by today's standards. But I'm sure in a year's time, after you collect all the fragments, it'll be outdated again.
yes, have to admit - you were more correct about the "virtual elegance", than I was. I think I'm seeing this:
1) First chance at TF Silver upgrade fragments in TRIAL 9, for 75 fragments/1200 needed
2) First chance at TF Gold upgrade fragments in TRIAL 18, for 75 fragments/1200 needed
Here's how this works:
a) you have to have a 5x6 Terrace Farm
b) you have to have a TF level 2 upgrade to that, size of upgraded Level 2 is still 5 x 6
c) Once you have your Silver upgrade kit complete, it's executed on the Level 2 TF, reducing it's size to 5 x 4.
d) Once you have your GOLD upgrade kit complete, it's executed on the Silver TF, reducing it's size to 4 x 3.
So 1 base, + 3 arduous upgrades over a LONG time... gives you that final prize.
You're right. Brass rings for sure. Realistically - Not expecting to ever be near TRIAL level 18, where I would meet warriors fighting me boosted to 5300 - 5900%
Some people can do that here, I'm not one of them.
e2m2
Member
The size of the earlier TF doesn't really matter since you don't have to deploy it until you have all Silver and Gold Frags collected.
It would require 16 weeks of playing Trial 18 to get the required Silver and Gold frags. And like you, I am nowhere near being able to complete Trial 18, but I know players who can do it easily.
McBluefire
Active Member
Max diamonds for any trial is 90. Old GE had possibility of 360 if I recall correctly there were 4 encounters in GE4 that had possibility of 90 diamonds. Most weeks I got 90, some weeks 180. Now max no matter what trial is 90. Hey , at least at the beginning of GE you can check in all the trials and then pick the one that guarantees 90 diamonds. Now there is some fun extra gaming! Click on 30 trials and scroll down to GE4 to see. /sarcasm Boy was I wrong that this is just a nerf... we got a while new minigame! /sarcasm off