Goods from Obs, Atomium, Arc etc. satisfy quests for guild treasury contributions

Discussion in 'Proposals' started by Hvckus the Hvckster, Feb 4, 2018.

  1. darthhenning

    darthhenning Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2016
    I'll agree that the market is a huge abuse for this and that should be limited. But Plundering and GE are perfectly valid ways to gather goods as much as production buildings.
     
    brentolomeus likes this.
  2. Elaine Trapp

    Elaine Trapp Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2017
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    USA, McAllister, Oklahoma
    Yes, but if the quest states from your stock than any GBs that do the donating would not count. Sorry but my vote is no.
     
  3. toolateformicro

    toolateformicro New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    I vote YES,
    especially for quests like the one I have: "Donate 140 goods from your age or the age below to the Guild Treasury".

    Most of the NOs are getting into semantic details. But for example the quest: "Gather/collect X goods" will be satisfied after a few trades even though I could end up with less goods than I had before the trades. Did I gather anything - NO - but nevertheless it is counted. Similar examples can be gives for almost all resource manipulation quests.

    I think that when a player collect the BPs, spent the goods and tiles and invested the FPs to build an Obs, Atom or Arc so obviously he/she had arranged regularly donations to the Guild Treasury even though they are automated.
     
    FlowerOS likes this.
  4. Hootengoben

    Hootengoben Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2017
     
  5. toolateformicro

    toolateformicro New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    It is not closed so it is not dead. I just expressed my opinion. I know that this proposal won't be accepted but for other reasons not for the ones presented.
     
  6. Algona

    Algona Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2015
    ...that we did it for reasons other then fulfilling Quests that were invented after the GBs were designed and introduced and that we still build these GBs now knowing that they will not fulfill these Quests.

    My Arc produces over 700 Foods per day. Despite that, I think that this Proposal is a bad idea.

    Wanna take care of this:

    If your daily Goods production isn't enough, build 1 or 2 smallest footprint boosted Goods building from your previous Era.
     
    Salsuero likes this.
  7. qaccy

    qaccy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2014
    Just be thankful the requirement isn't 'pay x amount of goods' like there are for coin and supply. At least goods from the treasury can still be used!

    Or if it bothers you that much, you could simply be guildless every day when you get your DC tasks...I would assume treasury (and GE) requirements don't appear if you aren't in a guild.
     
  8. toolateformicro

    toolateformicro New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    Your opinion was presented earlier. No need to repeat it. Big level Arcs are quite different story! :)
     
  9. Algona

    Algona Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2015
    Teah, I know. . This Proposal has been presented repeatedly. And this

    Has been brought up repeatedly in the repeated multiple Proposals on this topic as well as other places in this forum . So what's your point?

    If you think I'm spamming, report my post, but don't be so arrogant as to tell me how to post. I'd appreciate it.
     
  10. darthhenning

    darthhenning Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2016
    How though? because they produce more goods?

    But if someone were to somehow level their obs to 200 and get however many goods per day that generated? That's fine?

    It ether all good or all not, you can't have it both ways.

    The point of donation is to take from your stock and give it to the guild. Not build a GB.




    Also to those stating that "well trading in the market counts towards goods collection". That's not a reason to support this proposal, that's a reason to propose that abuse be terminated.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2018
    Salsuero likes this.
  11. toolateformicro

    toolateformicro New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    I have presented my opinion in this thread one time. You did it several times in the same thread. That is why I told you that there is no need to do so it won't become more convincing it will just remain your opinion.
    My point is to vote YES! :) I did it one time.

    Ok, but when the wording is "Donate 140 goods from your age or the age below to the Guild Treasury" my intuition says that Obs, Atom or Arc will count too as they do the same. If they want for me to donate from my inventory goods then say so like some quests "Donate XXX goods from your age or the age below FROM YOUR STOCKPILE to the Guild Treasury".


    The Arc makes possible for the Arc itself and for other GB to be level up 50+ (I have seen even 100+) levels. The bonuses then will be overwhelming. For example one player in my world have ~ 65 lvl Seed Vault with 12.5% for reward. With 200 aids per day that are like 160 refined goods per day (only from this GB) and goods will never be of any issue anymore. That is why it is a different story because it is way out of the normal game-play balance. I don't say it is bad I say that it is different story! :)
     
  12. darthhenning

    darthhenning Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2016
    But that is unnecessary.

    You do not "donate" from your Obs or Arc. If you hover your mouse over the description it states that the building "produces X of each current good for your guild treasury".

    Donation is defined as "A donation is a gift given by physical or legal persons, typically for charitable purposes and/or to benefit a cause."

    The GBs are not persons and they do not give gifts. By donating you are giving a gift of goods to your guild to benefit its causes.

    There should be no confusion in the wording as is.


    It is now part of the normal game-play balance.

    In point of fact on the more active/established european servers it is more likely to see CF and Traz as the highest level GBs rather than Arc.

    So no that argument does not hold weight.
     
    Salsuero, Graviton and Hootengoben like this.
  13. Elaine Trapp

    Elaine Trapp Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2017
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    USA, McAllister, Oklahoma
    Sorry, but your argument isn't sound for the quest you gave as an example gives you a choice while the donating quest doesn't.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2018
  14. toolateformicro

    toolateformicro New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    What argument and argument for what? :) If you mean by argument my statement that with 80+ lvl Arc the game is different than without it then you are not right by saying "that argument does not hold weight". High level Arc changes everything and render most of the game challenges meaningless. What does it matter whether the CF and Traz are the highest level or it is the Arc? Obviously the Arc makes these 50+ lvls GBs to be possible.


    Threads like this shows that it is quite necessary! If you type define:donate in Google:
    Give (money or goods) for a good cause, for example to a charity. - Exactly what you do when investing resources into building Obs-like GB.

    I can see your point that the Obs auto-donation is not a real donation. Like the Obs is not yours but a Guild property. On the other hand I have build the Obs I have to organize its leveling and collecting and if I change the Guild the Obs goes with me. So Obs-like GB are something more in-between. That is why "donate" does not specify clearly that the goods have to come from your stockpile. The players that have invested the resources to build, level up and collect regularly an Obs-like GB are rightfully to think that they are donating to the Guild (as an alternative to give goods from your stockpile). The quest have to specify where the donated goods have to come from? I disagree that it is clear only with the word "donate".


    Exactly my point. The quest have to specify that the goods have to come from my stockpile and we won't be having any discussion here. Everything would be clear! :)
     
  15. gutmeister

    gutmeister Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Agree with most points here. The obs/arc/atomium contributions certainly feel like you're donating them, but also for the purposes of the challenge I don't think they should count. However, most people's argument that "you're not sacrificing anything by contributing goods from the Arc" is really silly, given that INNO explicitly allows reciprocal trades to count for gather goods, let alone how easy collecting goods is without most players "going out of their way" to do that either. Given that they go out of their way to allow nonsense trades to count seems weird, but that doesn't mean they should also allow easy GB collections to count for donations.

    In short, I empathize with OP that it's not really fair/consistent, but my problem is with the goods counting, not the Obs goods not counting.
     
  16. LacLongQuan

    LacLongQuan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2012
    Big No, make the game too easy. I still want medal count to my ranking points though lol
     
  17. darthhenning

    darthhenning Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2016
    Yes, a level 80 arc changes the game. But so does literally every GB at high levels. The POINT of GBs is to change the game.


    The issue here is "what is the difference between goods donated by an Observatory and donated by an Arc?" There is not one other than volume.

    So to try and differentiate the two for this purpose is not logical. And if the Observatory gets included, inevitably people will then say "well why not Arc/Atom?" And they'd be right.

    So again, strong no.



    And right there you again show that you aren't right in your own words.

    You INVEST in an observatory. You do not DONATE the production from the observatory. Those are completely different thhngs.

    Then that is your reading comprehension issue. Not a game problem.
     
    Salsuero likes this.
  18. Algona

    Algona Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2015
    Good ol' Arc. Warps every aspect of the game it touches.

    And you want to enable Arc to warp more?

    INNO did a nice job of shielding Event and DC Quests from Arc: Arc does not help directly jelp with winning fights. Spending Supplies. Negotiating GE. Producing X timed productions. Donating Goods to the Treasury, Negotiating Sectors.. Gathering Goods. Spending Tavern Silver. Attacking Sectors. Infiltrating Sectors. Collecting Tavern Silver. Scouting. Visiting X Taverns. Technology. Spending Coins. Provinces. mo/po X players.

    How is enabling Arc to do more DC and Event Quests good for the game?

    That went out the window quick.
     
  19. toolateformicro

    toolateformicro New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2017
    This is not my point! I said that when they use the word "donate" it is not clear that the goods have to come from my stockpile. Obs-like building have to count too since other words they use like "collect" or "gather" also have a broad meaning as explained many time before.


    Here again the Arc has nothing to do with my point. If they want from me to donate from my stockpile then say so "Donate XXX goods from your stockpile ..." and everything is clear.


    This interpretations of yours would be unneeded if they simply specify where the goods have to come from.

    The goods produced by Obs-like building feels like donation. I invest into an Obs but the goods it produced are auto-donated to the Guild.


    Obviously not only mine and being precise in the wording never hurts. :) Or you have found an INNO dictionary with entries like:
    "donate" - only from your stock pile
    "gather" - collect, plunder, win, trade


    To sum up: there are two versions of the donation quest that INNO use: "Donate XXX goods ...." and "Donate XXX goods from your stockpile ..." I have came across both versions many times. My point is that for the first version Obs-like building should count since it is not specified where the goods have to come from and one automatically apply the broad meaning of the "donate" (like the word gather). This has nothing to do with making the game easier since they can always use the second version when they want.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2018
  20. Graviton

    Graviton Active Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2015
    While it may not have been clear before, it is now, yes?

    Actually we're using the word "donate" correctly, I think. You're insisting that it means "give goods to the Guild that already belong to the Guild."
     

Top