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Guild Battlegrounds Arrival Feedback

  • Thread starter DeletedUser4770
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Fracchia

New Member
Another thing I can’t find an answer for: why isn’t there some sort of support pool in gbg? Why can’t the obs count in gbg? A naive idea would be to add a basic defensive boost (attrition would add to that), based on the guild avg obs level, as computed daily at attrition reset time. Or even further, based on the avg defensive army boost of the guild (only from buildings and great buildings, tavern/inventory boosts excluded) although that might be more complicated.

for negotiations, the defensive boost should be translated in an inflation rate, using the same proportion currently in place for attrition.
 
Salsuero

Salsuero

Well-Known Member
Fracchia said:
why isn’t there some sort of support pool in gbg? Why can’t the obs count in gbg?
Click to expand...

Answer: GBg isn't GvG. They operate as entirely separate, entirely distinct features. Why doesn't the support pool help us in GE? Because it doesn't. All of these features have their own functionalities.

Fracchia said:
for negotiations, the defensive boost should be translated in an inflation rate
Click to expand...

Why? Negotiations are worth twice as much as fights. They already have a buff to them.
 

Fracchia

New Member
Salsuero said:
Answer: GBg isn't GvG. They operate as entirely separate, entirely distinct features. Why doesn't the support pool help us in GE? Because it doesn't. All of these features have their own functionalities.



Why? Negotiations are worth twice as much as fights. They already have a buff to them.
Click to expand...

With al due respect, this doesn’t answe the question. Yes, they are different features, but that doesn’t mean the support pool cannot be translated into a buff in gbg too. But my question is not specifically for the obs, but more general. We do get offensive gb bonuses in gbg, why not defensive? A naive solution could be: take all the defensive army boost of all the guild members (at server reset, excluding potions or tavern boosts, only permanent ones), divide by guild size at reset time; that’s the def boost your provinces get (might need to be adjusted with some scaling). but there might be other better ways. Point is, why not giving gbs like Deal Caste some new meaning? Additionally, it would give guilds a real way of increasing their defense strength.

Regarding negotiations: what I meant is that, just like attrition translates to both military and negotiating toughness, then also ”defensive boosts” could translate to both military and negotiating defense (otherwise having a military defensive boost would be pointless: the other guilds could just negotiate)

anyhow, I was curious on whether the devs considered giving guilds a way to boost their defenses through guildies city buildings/gbs. my thought on obs or other defensive gbs was just one random idea,
 
Nicholas002

Nicholas002

Well-Known Member
Fracchia said:
With al due respect, this doesn’t answe the question. Yes, they are different features, but that doesn’t mean the support pool cannot be translated into a buff in gbg too. But my question is not specifically for the obs, but more general. We do get offensive gb bonuses in gbg, why not defensive? A naive solution could be: take all the defensive army boost of all the guild members (at server reset, excluding potions or tavern boosts, only permanent ones), divide by guild size at reset time; that’s the def boost your provinces get (might need to be adjusted with some scaling). but there might be other better ways. Point is, why not giving gbs like Deal Caste some new meaning? Additionally, it would give guilds a real way of increasing their defense strength.

Regarding negotiations: what I meant is that, just like attrition translates to both military and negotiating toughness, then also ”defensive boosts” could translate to both military and negotiating defense (otherwise having a military defensive boost would be pointless: the other guilds could just negotiate)

anyhow, I was curious on whether the devs considered giving guilds a way to boost their defenses through guildies city buildings/gbs. my thought on obs or other defensive gbs was just one random idea,
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the reason I and other players will oppose this idea, is that it reduces the amount of rewards possible to get in GBg.

another thing to consider is that there already is attrition as a defensive boost.
how would the "support pool" interact with attrition?
 

Fracchia

New Member
I agree, it would make getting rewards harder. Whether you like that or not depends on how challenging you want your game to be. I do like rewards, but sometimes I have to admit that I get a ton of stuff in a single day from gbg (if you have several Siege Camps, gbg can be quite profitable). I wondered whether it was “too much” at times...

it would also make conquering provinces less frequent I guess. In a way, it’d be closer to what war is/was: slowly gaining control. And it would happen less often to log in after say half a day and see the map completely and utterly changed. I guess you’d like it better if you like games with slower pace maybe?

Finally, regarding interaction of attrition and support: support would provide a “basic” boost; attrition would still incrementally increase the boost. E.g, the avg defensive army boost of your guild is 34.6%? Great, if someone with 0 attrition attacks your prov, she/he/they will face an army with a 34% boost. If their attrition is 10, it will be 34% plus whatever an attrition of 10 gives. To figure out the nego inflation, use the same formula that is used for attrition; more precisely, if the attrition that gives 34% army boost gives inflation, say, of 3, then the starting nego inflation will be 3.

this would incentivate me to boost my DC, or even building st basil. As of now, I really don’t need them. And since they don’t help my guild at all, I have no pressure to build them.
 
Agent327

Agent327

Well-Known Member
Fracchia said:
this would incentivate me to boost my DC, or even building st basil. As of now, I really don’t need them. And since they don’t help my guild at all, I have no pressure to build them.
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And that's why this is a bad idea. You want Battlegrounds to be changed, so you will have some need for two GB's. Those GB's already have a function and if that is not enough for you, don't build them. That applies to all GB's.
 

Plain Red Justice

Active Member
Salsuero said:
Negotiations are worth twice as much as fights. They already have a buff to them.
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Not really. Negotiations are slow to do and not actually used for sector racing exactly because they are used for earning more rewards with little to no GB requirements. Increasing the amounts of advances this action does only serves to make it worse to act as a balance for its objectively higher reward percentage than battling
 

Earl Underfish Grayvase

Active Member
Agent327 said:
And that's why this is a bad idea. You want Battlegrounds to be changed, so you will have some need for two GB's. Those GB's already have a function and if that is not enough for you, don't build them. That applies to all GB's.
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That doesn't make it a bad idea, just an idea you don't like. From my interpretation of what Fracchia has suggested, and please do so correct me if I am wrong Fracchia, they are not looking for GbG to change in order to give meaning to build two great buildings, rather suggesting a potential additional use for two great buildings largely unbuilt given their current active/passive bonuses. The suggestion is not for personal gain or to make the game easier for any specific player, in fact the suggestion makes the game more difficult in many regards. For example, if these GB's were given something akin to the suggested bonus, making the decision to build them along with finding the space in which to do so is patently more difficult for most long term players. Also it could potentially make the battles more difficult hence making acquiring the sector more difficult while potential reducing the personal rewards.
Point being, when a suggestion is made that doesn't violate the DSNL, actually think about it rationally before responding sarcastically. Cartoons.
 
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Iroh the Tea Maker

Iroh the Tea Maker

Active Member
GbG rewards seem to be pretty low or did not show up in 7-8 fights in a row today. In platinum league, the probability for this is low and has been happening a lot past few days. Initially I thought it was a bug turns out it's not. Has GbG been nerfed as a part an update?
 
RazorbackPirate

RazorbackPirate

Well-Known Member
GBG has not been nerfed. It's just the nature of an RNG. Each encounter has the same chance of winning a reward, and both rewards and no rewards tend to cluster. It's over a large number of encounters that the RNG is accurate, but in a small sample size like 7-8 fights, the results will be all over the place.
 
Nicholas002

Nicholas002

Well-Known Member
rajavno1 said:
GbG rewards seem to be pretty low or did not show up in 7-8 fights in a row today. In platinum league, the probability for this is low and has been happening a lot past few days. Initially I thought it was a bug turns out it's not. Has GbG been nerfed as a part an update?
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this week I have got more rewards than ever. that's just how RNG works.

If you have a, say, 50% of getting a reward, you are not guaranteed to get one exactly every other fight. sometimes you will get one 3 times in a row, then you will miss the next three. Or you get a reward 20% of the time this week, but Alaric the Wise, will get a reward 80% of the time, so it all evens out.
 
RazorbackPirate

RazorbackPirate

Well-Known Member
Fracchia said:
Another thing I can’t find an answer for: why isn’t there some sort of support pool in gbg? Why can’t the obs count in gbg? A naive idea would be to add a basic defensive boost (attrition would add to that), based on the guild avg obs level, as computed daily at attrition reset time. Or even further, based on the avg defensive army boost of the guild (only from buildings and great buildings, tavern/inventory boosts excluded) although that might be more complicated.

for negotiations, the defensive boost should be translated in an inflation rate, using the same proportion currently in place for attrition.
Click to expand...
The short answer is, because Inno chose not to have Support Pool affect GBG. Inno never explains their reasoning, so that answer will have to suffice. GBG not utilizing Support Pool was brought up multiple times on Beta long before GBG went live and GBG went live without it. It might be related to the fact that GBG has no defense other than the defensive structures your guild can build. With no Defending Armies, there's nothing to add defense or support boosts to.

However, with the upcoming PvP Arena, defense will again be important. While there's still much being worked out on Beta, one thing is certain, the more defense you have for your defending army, the harder it will be to defeat you. So there may be some reason to build those defense GBs, just not for GBG.

I think it's inevitable that at some point GvG will go away completely. At the point that it does, It makes sense that the GBs that give Support Pool like Obs, will get a new boost. I don't much care that Support Pool is only used in GvG. ToR is only used for GE and unlike Obs, has no daily collection reward. Obs' treasury goods can be used in GBG to build province buildings, so it's still useful for GBG. I'm okay with different GBs boosting different parts of the game.

Not everything needs to be useful for everything, nor does everything need to fit one's particular play style. If you find the boosts a GB gives you useful, build it, if not, don't.
 

Fracchia

New Member
it’s not a great explanation, but as you said, I guess it will have to suffice. TBC, I’m not criticizing your post. as you said, inno doesn’t have to justify their choices, so I’ll live with it.

tbc though, since I think I made a mess when writing down my thoughts, I wasn’t advocating for an extra use for those gbs. Instead, I was wondering why there wasn’t any way to support your defending army in Your sectors (they are bot armies, but still defending armies they are). The idea of recycling those gbs for that purpose was just one possible to achieve that.

anyhow, I guess enough has been said on the subject. I’ll move on.
 
Salsuero

Salsuero

Well-Known Member
Plain Red Justice said:
Negotiations are slow to do and not actually used for sector racing exactly because they are used for earning more rewards with little to no GB requirements.
Click to expand...

Maybe if you're fighting alone, but they work GREAT for us... and also against us. I dunno... can't explain why it's been a different experience for you. Once we run out of fights, we can negotiate for A LONG time. That's a pretty good buff in and of itself. As for no GB requirements... there aren't really any GB "requirements" to fight either. But we do use the Chateau and other GBs for goods accumulation. Soooo... I dunno.
 
Salsuero

Salsuero

Well-Known Member
Fracchia said:
I was wondering why there wasn’t any way to support your defending army in Your sectors (they are bot armies, but still defending armies they are).
Click to expand...

But those defenders never belonged to you, unlike GvG. Again... there are differences between them and you've pointed several out here. It keeps things a little more interesting when different aspects of the game have different mechanics. Having things blur together too much just makes them too close to the same thing. Maybe it wouldn't be "too much" for you, but it would be for others. The devs made their decision. It works the way it is. If you're only wondering why, but not trying to actually suggest a change... well, the answer is -- the devs decided they didn't want it to work that way. As incomplete as that answer may be... it's an answer.
 
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