Guild Expedition- New Rewards

[DeletedUser27889]

I'm contributing to an Arc right now, so I hope that doesn't happen soon.
I don't think losing forge point packs in G.E. or Treasure Hunt is going to make people leave the game.
Will they gripe? Oh yeah. It's their choice to gripe.

I agree. I don't think people will leave over Treasure Hunt or GE fps. I think most people just see the inevitability that quest FP packs are on the chopping block next, then comes the Arc nerf, which is where they will see long standing players exit, then comes the end of packs all together.

I do think people will delete their ToRs, they have refused for quite some time to put out an updated drop table for it with the new buildings. They have said on beta, I don't know if it was left out of this announcement for some reason that the 100FP and 20Fp relic chances were reduced, but never an actual number as to how much. I had stopped reading the beta feedback thread but by middle of the second week no one had reported getting either. At this point with how long they have kept the drop table a secret I don't even know if when it is released it could be trusted, I would wait for some trusted players to self report.

When I first read about that I had stopped using my additional BPs to unlock higher ToR levels. Instead I keep them in my inventory now so that if they removed the FPs from GE I could delete ToR and free up room. FPs were the main reason I built it, that and the chance of a SoK or Wishing Well, which I've never won but then again am not all too lucky. I'm keeping the bps just incase they come to their senses afterwords and bring the good rewards back I'd be able to build again if I found the room.

 

[DeletedUser18177]

An Arc nerf would be the end of times. I did a lot of hard work to get where I'm at. Just thinking of that makes me want to shoot animals =.








jk

 

[wolfhoundtoo]

And what about the Arc?

 

[wolfhoundtoo]

I agree. I don't think people will leave over Treasure Hunt or GE fps. I think most people just see the inevitability that quest FP packs are on the chopping block next, then comes the Arc nerf, which is where they will see long standing players exit, then comes the end of packs all together.

I do think people will delete their ToRs, they have refused for quite some time to put out an updated drop table for it with the new buildings. They have said on beta, I don't know if it was left out of this announcement for some reason that the 100FP and 20Fp relic chances were reduced, but never an actual number as to how much. I had stopped reading the beta feedback thread but by middle of the second week no one had reported getting either. At this point with how long they have kept the drop table a secret I don't even know if when it is released it could be trusted, I would wait for some trusted players to self report.

When I first read about that I had stopped using my additional BPs to unlock higher ToR levels. Instead I keep them in my inventory now so that if they removed the FPs from GE I could delete ToR and free up room. FPs were the main reason I built it, that and the chance of a SoK or Wishing Well, which I've never won but then again am not all too lucky. I'm keeping the bps just incase they come to their senses afterwords and bring the good rewards back I'd be able to build again if I found the room.

forge points were still being reported and were reported in the very thread you refer to here.

 

[DeletedUser27889]

forge points were still being reported and were reported in the very thread you refer to here.

I had kept up with the thread for the first week and a half after it's release and no one reported anything. I looked back at the thread now and it is 27 pages long. I did a query on each page using '100' and read every reference, on the very last page was one person reporting they won 100 FPs twice. So one person reporting back with 100fp wins after a month since it's release in beta. Maybe others aren't talking about it or you can show me something I missed using this query but a drop table has not been released. Nor have they quantified what they mean by 'chances of 20 and 100 fp being slightly reduced' despite repeated questions from the beta community. Even in their attempt to be more straight forward and explain the changes greater: https://forum.beta.forgeofempires.com/index.php?threads/guild-expeditions-changes-continuation.6966/ they still refuse to answer the question.

It's not even an opinion based matter, people are asking for the numbers the developers had to use in order to program it in. Having a 6x6 building in our cities that were supposed to keep but not allowed to know what it does is just silly. They have had a month to drop the numbers and keep refusing, obviously there's a reason there.

 

[ITown]

I do think people will delete their ToRs, they have refused for quite some time to put out an updated drop table for it with the new buildings.

I don't know anybody who plans to delete TOR just because the relic table is out of date.

They have said on beta, I don't know if it was left out of this announcement for some reason that the 100FP and 20Fp relic chances were reduced, but never an actual number as to how much.

I would assume it wasn't mentioned here because it's not happening. You shouldn't assume that everything is released exactly as it is on beta.

I'm keeping the bps just incase they come to their senses afterwords and bring the good rewards back I'd be able to build again if I found the room.

Where from this announcement do you get the impression that the FP relic reward rates will be lowered?

 

[DeletedUser27889]

I don't get if from this announcement, which is missing almost all it's contents, I am getting it from the beta announcement which included much more content.

I don't know anybody who plans to delete TOR just because the relic table is out of date.

Not because it is out of date but because they seemingly wont release a new one. Also because of the nerfs in FP drops. Read the feedback thread it's all there along with several pages of people stating they see no point in keeping their ToRs for these buildings. I'm inclined to agree with them. Or to share an image piorr a beta tester created

https://forum.beta.forgeofempires.c...ges-and-4th-difficulty.6910/page-9#post-41310

It is possible that maybe due to overwhelming negative feedback in beta they have decided not to bring the change live yet. Or, considering the community manager who posted the announcement here didn't post their announcement correctly and it is missing all the relevant facts about the buildings themselves, they also left out these details. Since they have had around 10 hours to correct their mistake and have not by now, nor hung around to answer any of these questions all we can do is speculate.

If we are using beta as a guide since they received more information there when this was released then according to the information we have there, battle difficulty has been altered in the way Nodge posted from beta, chances for FPs in relics have been reduced, all FPs won will now go to bar. Maybe they plan to make some of these changes in stages here but again, there is no rep to tell us so we can only speculate.

However, if these new buildings are now in the relics, obviously somethings have been removed or some chances have been lowered. In order to have a chance to win one of these buildings you obviously have a lower chance to win something else.

 

[ITown]

It is possible that maybe due to overwhelming negative feedback in beta they have decided not to bring the change live yet. Or, considering the community manager who posted the announcement here didn't post their announcement correctly and it is missing all the relevant facts about the buildings themselves, they also left out these details. Since they have had around 10 hours to correct their mistake and have not by now, nor hung around to answer any of these questions all we can do is speculate.

I prefer to speculate based on the information that was provided on the live server, since it is more up-to-date.

Here's a quote from the up-to-date announcement:

Forge Points and other items that were available before are still there.

Here's a quote from the beta announcement:

• Overall, the chances for goods and Forge Points was slightly reduced in favor of new items, Expedition attempts and buildings.

From this I get the impression that they did not make the same changes here as on beta.

However, if these new buildings are now in the relics, obviously somethings have been removed or some chances have been lowered. In order to have a chance to win one of these buildings you obviously have a lower chance to win something else.

Right. That's why I asked which prizes the 1-up kit and store building kit are replacing. If they are replacing existing unpopular relics, I doubt anyone will complain.

 

[DeletedUser26154]

see the inevitability that quest FP packs are on the chopping block next

Not for Great Building contributions.
Having tens of thousands of free forge points in people's bars as they sleep or work...
Will create even more server memory problems.
I bet they would leave FP packs alone when it comes to Great Buildings.

 

[ITown]

Here's the correctly formatted version of this announcement (has the spoilers)

https://forum.en.forgeofempires.com...-expeditions-new-rewards-and-additions.33029/

 

[DeletedUser27040]

If Inno wants to have multiple forums, why can't they at least post consistent information across all of them? How many times has a dev or other staff member mentioned something in the German or EU forums that only made its way over to the US or EN forums because a player peruses multiple forums specifically because of that?

The new relics are mentioned in that post, but no mention of the other changes that were included on beta that Manda was referring to. Though I'm sure that's all the evidence you need to imply a change. If a pool of prize percentages already equals 100%; then you add five* new items to the pool without removing a corresponding number, then the odds for the existing prizes must be reduced.

*My understanding is that the Motivation Kit, Mass Motivation Kit, Expedition Attempt (packs), One Up Kit, and Store Building Kit are all relics that are rewarded via the ToR. The latter two are specifically mentioned in the announcement, which still makes my previous assertion valid.

I agree. I don't think people will leave over Treasure Hunt or GE fps. I think most people just see the inevitability that quest FP packs are on the chopping block next, then comes the Arc nerf, which is where they will see long standing players exit, then comes the end of packs all together.

This is where I was going, thank you Manda. Quest and possibly event FP Packs may be next if the current changes aren't enough to address lag. Then the only thing after that is the GB rewards and very likely the Arc itself if that is indeed a key contributor to the stated problem.

I hope it doesn't go that far and they can figure out a way to fix the code on all FP Packs so that they don't need to be further nerfed. However, if they were truly worried about server lag then why did they add the Tavern? The server calls on that thing alone must be immense, especially since every player has one. Also Kai has repeatedly stated that they could never add an 'Aid All' option (similar, yet slightly more complicated functionality to the tavern) specifically because of how great the resource pull would be on the server. Again stated problems or Dev goals don't mesh up with changes they are rolling out to the game.

 

[DeletedUser26154]

Read the feedback thread it's all there along with several pages of people stating they see no point in keeping their ToRs for these buildings.

I win enough relics to justify the ToR's existence in my city.
I'll never buy Decos again.
I've won many Watchfires because of my ToR.
I win the 100 FP relic on average, three out of every four weeks.
I win unattached troops which I love, because I usually do not build military buildings.
I can't justify leveling my ToR up to 30.
If I'm going to level a Great Building up to 30, odds are it'll be my Alcatraz.

I'd like to see the new relic drop percentages too.

the Tavern? The server calls on that thing alone must be immense

Yeah but that attack bonus boost is very nice.
What a price to pay for it.

However, if these new buildings are now in the relics, obviously somethings have been removed or some chances have been lowered. In order to have a chance to win one of these buildings you obviously have a lower chance to win something else.

I'm looking forward to seeing what's in store.

 

[DeletedUser27889]

This is where I was going, thank you Manda. Quest and possibly event FP Packs may be next if the current changes aren't enough to address lag. Then the only thing after that is the GB rewards and very likely the Arc itself if that is indeed a key contributor to the stated problem.

I agree with all of your points with exception to this one. The FP packs making the game go slower isn't a reference to lag or server issues. They are stating game progression, IE advancing eras, leveling GBs. They do not want people hoarding packs they want a 'consistant stream' of FPs through the game. I don't want to speak on issues I know little about, this would be more of a question for @sloppyjoeslayer but I highly doubt that FP packs create any lag at all to their system. It's just numbers there's really no big drain on their system in keeping track of numbers. You're not asking the server to load animations, you're not asking it to perform a probability function, you're not asking it to calculate the results of a battle.

I don't like to wear my little foil hat all to often but seeing as the Venice event roses also went to the bar I don't think this has anything to do with the game and is all about money. Beta spoiler

Spoiler

they are testing out a new GB contribution window that seems to make it harder to use packs, or use the ones you want to use but displays the ability to finish it off with diamonds more predominately

I believe they realized that no one was spending diamonds on FPs, FPs are highly valued in this game, SoKs have become rarer and rarer treasures, and they are making steps to try to increase FPs profitability which means limiting them. If it becomes the only way to be truly strategical from a GB perspective, or to sprint through tech to whip out a CC and pay for it, they will make more money. I can't even say I blame them, but I don't like this smoke screen pretending it's something it's not.

 

[DeletedUser27889]

I'm looking forward to seeing what's in store.

Yes and on a happy note I for one will be very happy to see a reduction of BPs, especially in the last chest.. Though I guess it's no longer the last chest but never the less a very welcome change.

Sorry for the double post.

 

[DeletedUser26154]

I for one will be very happy to see a reduction of BPs

That's what you think...

[This was made with Microsoft Paint]

 

[DeletedUser8420]

I clear all 3 levels pretty easily and barely use rail guns.

Battle Fortresses and Plasma Artillery are both pretty good, I usually use them as a combination.

point is with the nerf'ing going on I have lost interest....as have many others...

 

[DeletedUser8420]

Here is the announcement from beta that shows the buildings since darkstar was able to do it correctly over there
https://forum.beta.forgeofempires.c...ds-balancing-changes-and-4th-difficulty.6911/

A link at the bottom of that page will take you to the beta feedback for this as they have been playing for a few weeks now. General consensus is quite bad but obviously that didn't stop them from rushing it out here. Uglier buildings offering either nerfed rewards or larger in size as previous buildings. Nerferd chance of 100 and 20 FPs (though a drop table has been asked for for weeks now, none provided) and a 4th level so expensive only well established guilds with large treasuries would think of opening it.

I thought that with how bad the feedback to this was in beta we wouldn't be getting this for a bit longer but I guess not.

IT IS OBIVOUS.....THEY DONT CARE ABOUT FEEDBACK! Yes it is their game and thus they do what they want when they want and how they want, even though it is not good for the game....

 

[DeletedUser]

Anything is better than another flower arbor...

 

[DeletedUser27889]

That's what you think...

fixed

 

[DeletedUser27040]

I agree with all of your points with exception to this one. The FP packs making the game go slower isn't a reference to lag or server issues. They are stating game progression, IE advancing eras, leveling GBs. They do not want people hoarding packs they want a 'consistant stream' of FPs through the game. I don't want to speak on issues I know little about, this would be more of a question for @sloppyjoeslayer but I highly doubt that FP packs create any lag at all to their system. It's just numbers there's really no big drain on their system in keeping track of numbers. You're not asking the server to load animations, you're not asking it to perform a probability function, you're not asking it to calculate the results of a battle.

I don't like to wear my little foil hat all to often but seeing as the Venice event roses also went to the bar I don't think this has anything to do with the game and is all about money. Beta spoiler

Spoiler

they are testing out a new GB contribution window that seems to make it harder to use packs, or use the ones you want to use but displays the ability to finish it off with diamonds more predominately

I believe they realized that no one was spending diamonds on FPs, FPs are highly valued in this game, SoKs have become rarer and rarer treasures, and they are making steps to try to increase FPs profitability which means limiting them. If it becomes the only way to be truly strategical from a GB perspective, or to sprint through tech to whip out a CC and pay for it, they will make more money. I can't even say I blame them, but I don't like this smoke screen pretending it's something it's not.

My mistake, I misinterpreted Panacea's quoted statement that packs "slows down the game" as lag, not advancement progress. With the myriad of reports on GvG lag and my own observations loading the game, especially the event log, I just assumed that's what they were referring to.

I noticed that little tweak with the GB window. While yes, it does spruce it up nicely, making it harder/more annoying to spend packs, but easier to spend diamonds is an intriguing indication. However, they also removed packs from premium purchases much to the annoyance of many who purchased them after the update. So who knows what they are really going for. I know that events are a money maker, even if an annoyance to many. The impulse to spend a few bucks, or more, to get that prize or edge out the top score in a neighborhood competition is enticing. Direct roses seem to be an encouragement for impulse spending, while constant events encourage new players to advance and hopefully keeps veteran players occupied.

True nothing yet is enough to scare many players off, a series of large changes to the game all at once shortly after a series of nerfs to enhance balance (RGs, Crystal Villas, etc.) do create an environment of mistrust and paranoia. This is especially true when the ones making the changes are perceived as being secretive.