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GvG Improvements Update Feedback

DeletedUser40143

Our guild has numerous players who can't make calc time because it's 8pm eastern, and are looking forward to multiple recalc times. Be it every 4h, 6h, 8h, whatever, we are looking forward to some change to get those players involved. It will definitely increase participation. There will be inevitable changes to tactics (we are one of those guilds that tries to build a wall each night) but we're willing to accept that.

What I hope inno is thinking about is the drain on the treasuries this will have of many guilds that try to hold tiles and achieve ranking. Ghosts who don't care about holding tiles will have the advantage of low siege costs, and the strong guilds won't be able to maintain tile counts. As a result, the guild rankings won't properly reflect strength of guilds, which is ultimately bad for the game. I would suggest some modification to siege costs of ghosts, and a removal of the goods refund when dropping tiles.
 

DeletedUser

We're not talking about outlier max usage with Recalc. We're talking about regular rush hour.
Okay, let's go with that example. Have you ever seen a city that built their road system specifically for rush hour traffic? No, you haven't. People put up with it because building enough roads/lanes to handle rush hour traffic without any delays is not cost effective, and they know that's the price you pay for working in certain areas during certain hours. Just like GvG. You want to fight only at one certain time, and the price for everyone doing that is rush hour traffic daily at 8 PM Eastern.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Just crying doom about the proposed changes serves absolutely no purpose. Suggest ways to improve the changes. All these rants about doom and gloom over the status quo being upset makes it almost impossible for anyone to find actually helpful suggestions in this (or any) feedback thread.
 

DeletedUser38319

This is why I care less and less about FOE - too much stupid going on. Ipenguin set forth a full list of suggestions initially.
 

Algona

Well-Known Member
My first Event in game was Easter 2015. The most complained about part of that Event on the forum? Players had a choice, they could Aid or hide an Easter Egg in onther players city, which meant folk didn;t get enoughAid for thier cities. Ls was among thise that complained about this.

INNO listened. They made a change, Easter 2016 you did not choose between between Aiding and hiding Eggs. That was the most complained about aspect of the 2016 Event, Notsurprising, Ls complained about that as well.

We don't have Easter Events any more, there's no hiding Eggs any more.

The folk who mistakenly say INNO does not listen are wrong, their memory about such gets erased as soon as they find the next thing to complain about.

The problem isn't that INNO doesn't listen, the problem is that their resolution of player gripes can never satisfy everyone.

It literally is a case of being careful what you wish for you may get it.

----------

INNO is not gonna change the fundamental design of GvG. No mobile. no major rewrite, no fundamental changes. They've stated their reasons and it is their property to do with as they please.

INNO has three choices. Scrap GvG. (They won't, they make money from it). Not do anything at all. (They haven't for years, but since complaints about GvG are frequent, they are listening and making changes.) Make changes to GvG within the current framework of GvG.

If INNO could fix the problems just by throwing hardware at it, the problems would already be solved. I won't go through that argument again, if you don;t get it, you never will. Just try to avoid operating anything more complicated then a can opener.

SO INNO is making changes within the current scope of GvG.

Of course some people won;t like that. Nothing INNO does goes without some of a quarter of a million players not liking it.

Years of justifiable griping about GvG and INNO is making changes. You got what you wished for, live with the consequences of not thinking things through:

INNO is for profit, hence anything they do is profit driven. Obvious (to anyone who thinks things through) if a major rewrite could be proifitable (eg, conversion to HTML 5) they would have done it.

Look on the bright side, at least INNO did not just scrap GvG. Your wallets saved you there.

----------

Doubtless Ls and maybe others will accuse INNO fo incompetence. Ls has been doing that for years.

The incompetent people that make the game that is so attractive Ls has spent years and by his own words money (he quit claiming he spends cash right about the time GEIV [ hardly surprising, Ls complained about that as well] and spamming of Wishing Wells started) putting in enough time and effort to become one of the top players in the world.

Anll the while despising the people who provide it.

I will never understand the mindset of folk who hate INNO while spending significant time playing the game.

As for judging INNO's competence, we play (and pay for) their game. They aren't paying us.
 

Algona

Well-Known Member
You and others think you are expert enough in GvG to know how to fix the issues because you've been on the forums and know the history, but you don't even participate with the product in a meaningful way.

You are one of the very few players who have mastered the far and away most difficult aspect of this deep and complex game managing a top notch GvG Team.

It's not a case of reading the forums or being expert in GvG or whatever, it's a matter of thinking things through from INNO's viewpoint.

My challenge to you is to look at things from a different viewpoint. Not as a player, but from INNO's viewpoint.

You are already profitable, the owners and investors are used to continuous growth, they have full confidence in you Why not? You've got the experience and team that have delivered profits for 15 years.

But if you do make a mistake and lose money, kiss your job goodbye.

One other important factor, you know what the players in the game do and how they spend money and that everything you have done in 7 years of running FoE (inlcuding years of no changes to GvG) the player base and revenues keep growing.

You wanna make money and you know you can get away with a lot regarding your client base.

What are you gonna do with GvG?

The answer is of course obvious, whatever makes the most money.

Guess what? That's what INNO is doing.

Some of us are not gonna like the details, but you know who will? The owners, investors, and the folk at INNO who keep thier jobs.
 

DeletedUser35715

Not trying to get into you guys pissing match here, but:

This is such a red herring. There is no business in the world that designs its capacity based on maximum usage. Whether it is employee scheduling, building size, vehicle fleet, or whatever. It just isn't good economics to pay for maximum anything based solely on peak usage times and then have much of it sit unused most of the time.

I've worked as a systems analyst/DBA/network engineer for several Fortune 100 companies and pretty much the industry standard on mission-critical systems is to take either your historical or anticipated peak loads on everything, bandwidth, processing, memory, storage, etc., and then add 20% to it... There is normally some huge major driving factor involved in causing a peak rush, end of workday, last day to ship before Christmas, tax day, whatever, and if you've designed the system to only handle the mean load and it fails you during the peak time, the costs go into the $100M's and $1B's real fast...
Now that said, in today's world with both public and private clouds, that's way easier to adjust to can be monitored and tweaked on the fly with load balancing and resource monitoring software, so it shouldn't even be a factor so long as the powers that be are behind providing a flawless end-user experience, like that big search engine company, online retailer and big auction site for 3 quick examples...

Lag is attributable to one thing and one thing only, recalc "forcing" players to all fight at the same exact time. Spread that out through the day and most of the lag issues go away.

BINGO!! (or as close to being able to say BINGO!! without actually having access to the backend systems info, codebase, database optimization or business decisions and budget driving the nuts and bolts) But standard Vulcan logic dictates that there shouldn't be any limiting reason preventing a redesign of the current system to perform recalcs on only 2 or 3 worlds per server per hour, then randomly change which worlds are synced together on a schedule, much like who competes against who in GE every week or Hood configurations, as well as doing it on either a predictable rolling schedule or a completely randomized, but controlled in a biased manner so as to force it to balance the times for everyone (this would avoid any statistical anomalies and keep the mean spread within the average players limited memory span, which I'm fairly confident Inno already has it worked out for GE neg and event prizes anyway)...
Now to expand on this suggestion/idea a little further, only allow recalc to happen within an 18hr window, based on the servers designated geographical zone... Making sure that it's balanced so it's fairly distributed across all timezones covered by the servers intended geography... Or just to keep it simple and straight forward, just set the earliest time any recalc can happen at Midnight +6hrs server time for all servers and the very last time at Midnight -1hrs server time (0600-2300hrs for those not completely following)... That right there alone provides all the desired benefits that the originally suggested changes were attempting to address, mainly fixing the horrible lag times by load balancing the servers workload across 18 hours rather than 45 seconds while also encouraging greater participation by bouncing recalc around, which also gives all of us regulars a chance to enjoy those last couple hours of each day when it's actually cooler and nice to be outside, while not adversely affecting GvG by removing all strategy from it in lieu of stylizing it after Call of Duty (Is anyone else having flashbacks to when Blizzard wrecked the StarCraft franchise with that FPS version only to come back to Remastered after losing 90% of the players??)
I'm sure the designers already know that they'll never get all the monkeys back into this can of worms once they open it... Just off the top of my head, shields will be dropping as fast as SA's can be made, there will no longer be any need or use for DA's of any sort, guilds are going to be so goods poor after the first 2 weeks, no one will be able to afford to fight in GvG at all except unless they're using medals in AA, but that'll only be for SAM except for the guys farming archers to employ sector catch and release for the SAM age fight farmers to convert into a nice pile of points without worrying about anything but the 7 sectors they'll take and drop 6 times a day... Sure, that's a gloom and doom point of view that could easily be fixed by also making the traz and arc cycle on the same every 4hr schedule, so yeah, I'm just saying change is good, but change just for the sake of change is a bad thing... Unless of course the whole reason for these changes are to push everyone into the GBG and completely do away with GvG, which is possible too I guess...
Taking what you already have and tweaking it to enhance what's already there and familiar to people is always going to be better than changing it completely and alienating existing players in hopes of vapor users appearing... Think McDonald's dropping burgers off the menu and going to spaghetti and ravioli... And just a quick note for some honest feedback here, I'm in a #1 guild and I'm on 98%+ of the time at recalc... The only reason for that is because I'm a team player and I've scheduled my life around the existing recalc, it's not by accident or because I have nothing better to do, especially this time of year... If someone wants to fight, they'll either schedule it to be there at recalc, just like those of us that show up are already doing or they'll show up whenever they get there and either fight whatever is left, defend whatever is vulnerable, pick a new fight or take the night off and stockpile more troops for the next night, pretty much just like the rest of us who fight GvG... There's no one in my guild, nor anyone else that I know of playing the game for that matter, that has said, "ew ew, finally recalc is gonna be every 4hrs (or some different time than it is now, or more than once a day), now I can finally come participate in GvG!!"... The only people that I've heard supporting recalc every 4hrs are the ones that have tried and failed at everything else they could think of to win, including flat out cheating with alts and spending $50k+ attempting it and figure this is finally the magic pill that's gonna be the thing that makes it happen...
Just my two cents...
Anyway, I came here to ask a question and you guys got me totally sidetracked....
 

DeletedUser35715

Have any of these changes, or any other rule changes to GvG been released yet?? Today, we were fighting for a sector in indy, the guild that held it, beat the seige with less than 2 DAs left and released it within 1sec, we resieged it and I hit auto to fight, won, then went back into the sector to fight again and then it appeared fully zipped with 8 DA's less the 3 or 4 that those of us fighting just killed off... We all seen the same exact thing, less than 2DAs after the resiege, then after 1 fight, it shows 8 DA's... And there was only about 1sec from when the swords disappeared till the sector was dropped, not even 3 people could have replaced those DA's that fast... If that's a new rule change, you just created Forge of Fight Farming...
Also the last 2 weeks, I've been seeing sieges and protected shields bleeding over from the maps beside the map I'm on, like on the shores that show but are greyed out, I can also see the bubbles going up while they fight them too... And at about the same time that started happening, we've had several people, myself included, attempt to place DA's on a map, like PE, CE, TE, etc and the army not appear... Then after submitting a ticket and someone hitting the logs, we find out it's consistently placing the DAs on our sectors in AA... What's up with that?? Now the bigger issue here is more than losing the 8 troops you were trying to use and not getting the DA and all those consequences, but what if the lower age troops are replacing SAM or VF DA's in AA??
 

DeletedUser10789

Algona,
I did complain about it, as I was NEW and I did not know much about it. Unlike most here, I had to learn the hard way and actually pay my dues and LEARN a game. In doing so, I encountered many errors that the game has made to effect all of our game play. Things have changed and why don't you bring up that me and a few others lobbied for the re-calc. NOT to be changed, but it was and you know what happened next. Please go look at all of my posts and see for yourself the things I say and the things I claim. My record is there for all to see and judge for themselves. If you want too, make a thread called bashing Stevie. I am sure you might have a few trolls who may join you. Additionally I have provided a few positive solutions to this problem and I will address them later, as it just stop re-calc. time for us real fighters on the game. Don't believe me, look at forge-db database and that will say it all. Look at H world for my stats and FYI, if you enjoy a 1.9 thread, then you are welcome. We, my guild with one other and I, created that and it seems everyone has it now, so please find something and do something, then you can pick on me. A simple thank you would be nice, by the way. And I took a guild to # 1 too and I assure you it was not by playing tiddlywinks. Look up Forge DB and my record then come at me with something better. I could go on a little but some of the mod here know my name as well. :)



My first Event in game was Easter 2015. The most complained about part of that Event on the forum? Players had a choice, they could Aid or hide an Easter Egg in onther players city, which meant folk didn;t get enoughAid for thier cities. Ls was among thise that complained about this.

INNO listened. They made a change, Easter 2016 you did not choose between between Aiding and hiding Eggs. That was the most complained about aspect of the 2016 Event, Notsurprising, Ls complained about that as well.

We don't have Easter Events any more, there's no hiding Eggs any more.

The folk who mistakenly say INNO does not listen are wrong, their memory about such gets erased as soon as they find the next thing to complain about.

The problem isn't that INNO doesn't listen, the problem is that their resolution of player gripes can never satisfy everyone.

It literally is a case of being careful what you wish for you may get it.

----------

INNO is not gonna change the fundamental design of GvG. No mobile. no major rewrite, no fundamental changes. They've stated their reasons and it is their property to do with as they please.

INNO has three choices. Scrap GvG. (They won't, they make money from it). Not do anything at all. (They haven't for years, but since complaints about GvG are frequent, they are listening and making changes.) Make changes to GvG within the current framework of GvG.

If INNO could fix the problems just by throwing hardware at it, the problems would already be solved. I won't go through that argument again, if you don;t get it, you never will. Just try to avoid operating anything more complicated then a can opener.

SO INNO is making changes within the current scope of GvG.

Of course some people won;t like that. Nothing INNO does goes without some of a quarter of a million players not liking it.

Years of justifiable griping about GvG and INNO is making changes. You got what you wished for, live with the consequences of not thinking things through:

INNO is for profit, hence anything they do is profit driven. Obvious (to anyone who thinks things through) if a major rewrite could be proifitable (eg, conversion to HTML 5) they would have done it.

Look on the bright side, at least INNO did not just scrap GvG. Your wallets saved you there.

----------

Doubtless Ls and maybe others will accuse INNO fo incompetence. Ls has been doing that for years.

The incompetent people that make the game that is so attractive Ls has spent years and by his own words money (he quit claiming he spends cash right about the time GEIV [ hardly surprising, Ls complained about that as well] and spamming of Wishing Wells started) putting in enough time and effort to become one of the top players in the world.

Anll the while despising the people who provide it.

I will never understand the mindset of folk who hate INNO while spending significant time playing the game.

As for judging INNO's competence, we play (and pay for) their game. They aren't paying us.
 

Algona

Well-Known Member
I did complain about it, as I was NEW and I did not know much about it. Unlike most here, I had to learn the hard way and actually pay my dues and LEARN a game

You'd been playing almost a year by Easter 2015, two years by Easter 2016, You bitterly complained about GE, the Friends Tavern, GE lvl IV, and now GvG changes. When do you stop being new?

You had to learn the game? That makes you special how? Is learning the hard way like walking to school uphill? What factors in the game and your life made you have to learn the hard way?

then you can pick on me.

I'm not picking on you, I'm stating exactly what you have said over the years. As you say, it is there for anyone to read. What is it you feel about your posts that makes you think that discussing your past posts is picking on you?

I cite those posts for the simple reason that you are constantly wrong so that folks could consider this when deciding to put credence in your current posts.
 

DeletedUser10789

I must add, Please do site my positions and what I have said, like I said, start a thread Bashing Stevie and I will even comment on it.

I started at the tail end of the Easter Event on 2014, I believe. I joined to play with friends and all of us did not know mush about the game.
Might I add, then much of this game was different as it is now. Meaning, the things we all have today, we didn't have then.
FYI, I love GE....On the first day, I had over a level 10 TOR. GE was new then and I knew the power of it. Again, when I started the game I didn't know the game and I was learning. I am man enough to admit that everyone has a learning curve, but it seems you don't. You must be a much better man than I.
Unlike you, I was playing with friends who made a guild and I was asked to run it and I declined. The leaders then decided to merge with another guild and we all went there. Someone asked for goods and I posted I would help and I got yelled at. Needless to say, that person and I solved that later on and worked it out. I left that guild and all of my friends started to leave as well. A new guild was made, RT it was not RT then it was RR. Then mails went back and forth and players went back to the guild we had merged with. The guild was then thrust on me and I was with less than 20 people then. I build it, merged with guilds, recruited and broke my butt in making a home for all. YES, I did it with help from people who came to the guild. The guild has changed players, as most guilds do, yet I was the leader and we took it to # 1, again by fighting. I had a family emergency and multiple family members who got sick and were in the hospital. I could not play for over 6 months time, last year. So, 2018 was not a good year for my family, yet I came back for my favorite event Christmas. Which they changed multiple times, like the Easter Event which has since been destroyed by the game. Looking back, 2014, that Easter event was one of the best but you see it take experience in learning what is good or not.

I must add, I have said before and I will say it again. There have been changes on this game, some good and some not so good and horrible. The devs. have made errors, like re-calc. before and we all know what they did to resolve that. So please know and allow everyone to read for themselves the ideas I have had and the things I have said. If you want to troll me or attempt to slander me, I could sit here and pick away at you and your record, yet I have a life and I have a guild to run. I highly suggest you do the same. Please post some positive solutions, if you can, instead of trying to create negative things about me. This is a forums for potential solutions, which again I have given. Have you or are you just one of those who want to banter or hinder another player. We all have opinions and that's fine, just state suggestions for positive solutions. Lastly, are you saying this is the same game as when you started.? As it is not. We all know this and again, some changes have been positive (like the Auto button when we fight, remember when we did not have that and people had to actually manually fight?) and some have NOT, but we all have to live with what the Devs and the game decides to spit out. You can agree with them or not, but one thing you MUST do is adapt or quit. Notice, I am here STILL, trying to give my opinion and positive suggestions to make the game better for all. Just because a few champ farm, which I don't, does not mean the game has to fundamentally change. Of the 5% who do GvG, as has been stated here, I would bet that less than 1/2 of 1% actually do that and most just fight. So, the solution is to destroy the re-calc time of 8:03pm EST and add a bunch more. This is not a new issue of lag due to re-calc. time. AGAIN, NOT NEW. There are simple solutions and many have given them, but instead we should change the game and GvG.? Really.? This has been tried before and let's just do the simplest solution, UPGRADE the servers and UPGRADE the capacity of them, so they eliminate the lag or reduce it. Nuke the Champs for points given out and who cares about the Champ Farmers. Why are so many upset by that, who cares, you are all being petty. By the way, there is a new feature coming like a GE on Steroids where Guilds can battle more. So, this new content will change the game again. Just fix the problems and issues with LAG and leave the rest alone.

This is a good game and reasons why people like me stay and play, I enjoy it and I enjoy helping my friends and my players. I help more people and am probably one of the nicest players on the game, believe it or not. Ask about me in H World for yourself. My record stands for itself. The game does not listen to it's players most of the time or they listen to people who want an easy game. When I started this game was harder. There was no daily rewards like there is now or friends tavern or even GE. All of these events too, have been fundamentally changed, some for the better and some for the worse. That is subjective to what the player likes. I stayed in FE for almost 2 years, as it is the best age and now I am in Space Aged Mars for various reasons. We can argue about the ages and all, but FE was and is awesome for many reasons. OH, by the way, there was NOT an AA age map, where guilds could train people on GvG, like we did in RT. I would load spears in the sectors and teach new players how to fight and learn. You see, we did that, we actually used AA for a positive purpose and help people in our guild. We were the first guild with over 80% of their players to have an ARC with over 70 players and at least 85% of those all came from my goods. So, please don't say I don't know about the game or can adapt. Again, the 1.9 came from US, RT. Be productive and make positive changes that will help the community, don't bash someone with good intentions and positive ideas. But I can think outside the box, as it has been posted and proven, I don't come on to bash others. I state positive solutions to help us all, a simple thank you is enough. Try it sometime.
 
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DeletedUser40780

Suggestions in no particular order. A lot of these are my ideas. Others are restatements of ideas other players proposed:

Reduce lag/increase availability/overthrow "the man"
  • Start with 12 or 8 hr recalcs before reducing the time more
  • Create rolling/dynamic recalcs such that shields go down at different times instead of all at once. (Bonus: can be tied to support pool to add extra strategy)
  • Add a cooldown to NPC Release and Recapture to prevent "walls"
  • If 4hr recalcs
  1. Give founders/leaders more drops
  2. Speed up recruitment
  3. Reduce siege/da cost for less than 10-15 tiles
  4. Tie protected sectors to support bonus. tiles with more support will keep shields through recalc up to 8,12, 24 hrs.
  5. Create a cooldown for how quickly a guild can reland after being removed from a map (96hr was suggest, too long imo. 24-48 prob better9
  6. Give guild power every recalc instead of just 1 main time
  7. Make guild ranking based on daily avg power instead of power at 1 specific time
  • Fix the code to be more efficient
  • Upgrade servers/hardware
  • Add mobile GvG (yes, I know, not happening. Doesn't change the fact that it's a suggestion that players want. Feel free to remind me though, just in case I forgot)
  • Stagger recalcs across worlds
Prevent/Reduce Farming
  • Add a cooldown to NPC Release and Recapture (1-4 hr is plenty.)
  • Increase medal cost to siege in AA
  • Remove all GvG points
  • Remove/reduce points from NPC tiles
  • Reduce Champ points
  • Replace units in NPCs with Random age units (AA only - can be mixed by DA or by sector)
  • Replace units in NPCs with the lowest point unit (spears or cave people? can't remember what they were called)
  • Fill NPCs to 8 DAs of lowest point unit in AA
  • Make Champs "all age" to give them a use besides farming. They would match the specific age used similar to rogues. In AA unit would match player's current age. (also useful for increasing activity on early age maps)
  • Increase cost to unlock DAs proportional to siege cost (10%/20%/30%)
Misc
  • Increase the number of available DAs to 16
  • Create a guild alert in guild chat when sieged (i love this with 4hr recalcs - otherwise 24/7 map will suck)
  • Bring back "mountain men" or whatever they were called (i.e. damage DAs, so guilds have to continually replace them in order to hold land)
  • Fix the bugs with sieges now showing.
  • Fix the bugs with being unable to siege/replace DAs when sieges are broken.

No less than 25 ideas here. Several are conflicting, obviously. None have really been discussed/debated. That's not a good sign that anything is going to be different than the proposed improvements. There's no way to even measure support for these other ideas in the current format.

I'm a huge inno fan. They've made a game that I've enjoyed playing a ton. I've spent money on the game to show support (and to get nice things, obviously) and I have openly encouraged others to do so as well. Of course, inno has to make money to keep the doors open. No one is faulting them for that (and if they are, they should quit playing - complaining freeloaders are a no go imo).

Companies try to predict the market. And while the past can help indicate the future, it's not always right. Blockbuster had a chance to buy Netflix and didn't because their numbers said it was the wrong choice. They missed the boat. Technology is hard to predict.

Inno clearly has made a choice to focus on the app (based on what I'm seeing and things longtime players have told me). They are putting a lot of their eggs in the GBG basket instead of fixing blatant lag and bug issues with GvG and/or working on a mobile GvG product. That's fine. We might love it and forget all about GvG. :) These GvG improvements could build a lot of bad will if done wrong. Players don't like feeling betrayed or tricked (see those that built TVP then lost the pvp bonus). At least consider how GvG players will view these changes if they pretty much kill gvg, and gbg rolls out just in time.

The reality is, developers might be expensive, but losing your most active user base might be more costly. It's a social game, and the community effects of certain players quitting is impossible to measure looking at aggregated data alone. Some users are worth a lot more than others (besides just how much they spend on diamonds).

Not trying to get into you guys pissing match here, but:

I've worked as a systems analyst/DBA/network engineer for several Fortune 100 companies and pretty much the industry standard on mission-critical systems is to take either your historical or anticipated peak loads on everything, bandwidth, processing, memory, storage, etc., and then add 20% to it... There is normally some huge major driving factor involved in causing a peak rush, end of workday, last day to ship before Christmas, tax day, whatever, and if you've designed the system to only handle the mean load and it fails you during the peak time, the costs go into the $100M's and $1B's real fast...
Now that said, in today's world with both public and private clouds, that's way easier to adjust to can be monitored and tweaked on the fly with load balancing and resource monitoring software, so it shouldn't even be a factor so long as the powers that be are behind providing a flawless end-user experience, like that big search engine company, online retailer and big auction site for 3 quick examples...

^--- Exactly!
Note: Websites/applications aren't comparable to airports or roadways. Analogies are good for explaining big picture concepts, but not arguing details.

Moderators engaging in petty arguments and trying to shoot down legitimate game feature discussion is a really bad look for inno. It just makes Panacea look that much more awesome.
 
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DeletedUser40780

Edit: Noticed that GvG and unit (champ) suggestions are DNSL for proposals. Is this our only place to discuss the upcoming changes?

I'm looking to our more veteran forum members - since this is a feedback thread, what would be the best approach to get discussion about alternative ideas in front of InnoGames devs?
 
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DeletedUser38319

Also the last 2 weeks, I've been seeing sieges and protected shields bleeding over from the maps beside the map I'm on, like on the shores that show but are greyed out, I can also see the bubbles going up while they fight them too... And at about the same time that started happening, we've had several people, myself included, attempt to place DA's on a map, like PE, CE, TE, etc and the army not appear... Then after submitting a ticket and someone hitting the logs, we find out it's consistently placing the DAs on our sectors in AA... What's up with that?? Now the bigger issue here is more than losing the 8 troops you were trying to use and not getting the DA and all those consequences, but what if the lower age troops are replacing SAM or VF DA's in AA??

Yep, been seeing this happen too, but personally, I have only had it happen to me in AA with the DAs also going to other AA tiles. I found that it is sometimes placing DAs in the most newly acquired sectors instead of the one I am trying to add to (even when they are SEVEN columns away... so no, it's not an accidental click).
 

DeletedUser38319

I am puzzled about a few aspects of these changes.

Currently:

1. 5% of people GVG
2. 1 Recalc per day
3. Lag is often laughably horrible especially at recalc

Inno's proposed future:

1. Increase GVG participation
2. Increase recalcs to 6 per day
3. Reduce lag by increasing the number of recalcs

Now... Please explain to me how lag will be reduced when many heavy GVGers will make it on for more than 1 recalc, we increase the number of those already participating in GVG, and we don't fix the server load issues? What happens when 4 of the 6 recalcs become bogged down?
 
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Irascible Raptor

New Member
We are a medium size guild that fights nearly every night. The 4hr recal times will add a few fighters, but we will never be able to hold land under those conditions. We are constantly being point farmed and these changes will mean that we will be point farmed 6 times as much. The goods cost and troops cost will simply be to much for us to sustain. I view this as a negative change. I dont know what the right fix is, but 4hr recals will only benefit points farmers.
 

DeletedUser40956

For those clamoring for 4 hour calcs, do you have any idea of the demand that would place on guild treasuries? I would like to just paint a small picture of good's cost if this were to occur using FE as the example:
Let's say you, as a guild of course, are holding 6 tiles on the Future Map, and you wanted to open only 4 additional DA slots on those 6 tiles to defend them. DA slots are exponential increases, so your first 2 slots on all 6 tiles costs 30 of each FE good (30 x 2 x 6 = 360 of each FE good). The 2nd batch of additional slots costs 60 of each FE goods to open (60 x 2 x 6 = 720). So far with 1 calc time, you're DA costs for FE have hit 1,080 of each FE good which is essentially 6-7 days worth of 1 FE located level 80 Arc collection. Think of that, 1 single Arc that is level 80 in your guild that is in the Future Age would take almost a full week of collections to cover opening 4 additional DA slots for your tiles for 1 of 6 calcs.

Now lets say you want to expand your land at 1 of the now 6 calcs to 10 tiles, so you place 1 siege (60), you place another (80), yet another (100), and finally you take that 10th tile (125) for a total cost of another 365 of each FE good. This of course is assuming that no one is on to defend those tiles and break your sieges. So far you've brought your total daily FE good's cost to a whopping 1,445 of each FE goods, and wait, you still have 5 more calcs to go today. You're now up to 9 days worth of level 80 Arc collection for 1/42th of a week

Who wants to do that 6 times a day? For those wanting more calcs, just look at the math. Either your guild will stop GvG all together, leaving the big guilds with 100% 80 Arcs in guild, or you won't open level 2 of GE, ever again. Those numbers aren't sustainable and those that think they are, get your head out of the sand and understand your guild's treasury workings.
 

DeletedUser6497

I will say this again because I'm told someone in Development reads this. All Ages includes Bronze Age. That was the way the map was introduced and changing that now was unnecessary and catered to a select few players in this game. Who are they? Why is Inno doing what they ask and not what the MAJORITY of the GvG players ask for? Why are the EXTREME GRAPHICS ERRORS not being addressed? Why is a minor change that defeats legitimate strategy being implemented instead? You would almost think that Inno is trying to distract us from the real problems with GvG.
 

qaccy

Well-Known Member
@Valekyrie I get the frustration, but personally I never understood why Bronze was allowed in AA in the first place. Sure, it says 'All Ages', but to me, that starts with Iron. It should've been called 'All GvG Ages' for clarity but they would have had to ban Bronze from the start as well (which they should have done). Even if spears are available to literally everyone with GvG access, it just seems like a bit of a degenerate playstyle. Decisions aren't as meaningful when troop training time is essentially removed from the equation.
 
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