Sheldor the Destroyer
Active Member
Here is a question- I know GvG isn’t coming to mobile, but what is the reasoning? GvG is probably the funnest part of the game, and mobile players are missing out.
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[Question] GvG
- Thread starter Sheldor the Destroyer
- Start date
wolfhoundtoo
Well-Known Member
As I recall the coding for GVG would have to be redone to make it ready for mobile and it would cost too much for them to convert it. If you know why it isn't coming what does the reasoning matter though? You were going to try and convince them to reconsider?
wolfhoundtoo
Well-Known Member
It feels very like they own the game and can do whatever they like with it. Maybe their projections are different from yours or maybe GVG they don't think will bring in enough continuing revenue to be worth 'hiring' that guy. Funny how so many people want to claim 'big brother' when they are the ones suggesting that the owner of the game should have to do what they say because they say so.
Johnny B. Goode
Well-Known Member
How many times do I have to point this out. THE HEAD GAME DEVELOPER WHO HAD THE PASSION FOR GVG DIED. ANY FUTURE FOR GVG DIED WITH HIM. Just be thankful you can still access it on PC for now. Sheesh.
(Oh, and to be precise, GvG is the "funnest" part of the game for you. Not for everyone. That's why less than 5% of active players even bother with it.)
RazorbackPirate
Well-Known Member
Correlation does not indicate causality no mater how much you write it in all caps. Any fantasy of what might have been is just that, fantasy. It is just as likely under his continued leadership, the game would have died years ago.
The issues of GvG run far deeper than the lead developer dying. In fact, the problems of GvG which kept it from being ported, that developer is entirely responsible for. Go back and read the announcement. Many reasons why, technically, it didn't make sense to port it. All of those Anwar's doing.
Emberguard
Well-Known Member
Basically Inno decided it'd require so much work to port it over for something that wasn't designed for mobile play and wouldn't suit mobile it'd make more sense to just redo the entire thing as an entirely new thing. Which is why we now have Guild Battlegrounds.
Johnny B. Goode
Well-Known Member
Sorry, but problems porting don't explain why it was not developed past Future Era except for the poorly thought out All Ages map, nor changed in any basic way for the last 5+ years. Anwar's death explains it all. The porting is just an excuse.
MJ Artisan of War
Well-Known Member
I wish they would just kill GvG already.... Tried it for awhile when I was in a guild that was trying to rise in the meaningless guild ranking system.
In my experience it is an endless drain on units and guild treasury goods for no return, other than those meaningless guild ranking points.
Don't see why anyone would prefer it over the rewards of GBG.... Just remove it already...
Anwar will still be Legendary.
In my experience it is an endless drain on units and guild treasury goods for no return, other than those meaningless guild ranking points.
Don't see why anyone would prefer it over the rewards of GBG.... Just remove it already...
Anwar will still be Legendary.
iPenguinPat
Well-Known Member
Because it's way more fun than gbg.
When you're Developing as a player those rewards might seem big but once you have a bunch of buildings that are over level 80 or 90 or 100.. and you have to forge point bank of 50,000 or 60,000 or 100,000 or 500,000 forge points.. then those rewards are peanuts and aren't really much incentive.
Gvg so much more dynamic and there's so much more variety. It's a shame that it so dead on so many servers.
iPenguinPat
Well-Known Member
To be fair, it's hidden from app players, so they don't have the option to play or not.
Most players don't even like gbg and only do it for the rewards.
Put them on a level playing field, and gvg would crush gbg. It'll never happen, but the 5% argument is dumb.
I wonder what % of players even play daily. Aggregates don't always tell you the important details. Segments matter.
Graviton
Well-Known Member
Not really. GvG is only played by ~5% of all players in part because it's not available on mobile, but mostly because players on other platforms aren't playing it either. According to Inno ~33% of all FoE players play on a platform other than mobile, and yet only a small percentage of them do GvG. That has nothing to do with the app store. So the 5% argument is perfectly valid: it tells us that the vast majority of players who can play GvG, don't.
Got some numbers to back that up? "Most" players would be thousands, so that was a pretty big survey.
That's true, but I'm wondering what important details are being missed. Mobile players make up a majority of all players, but that still leaves a lot of PC/tablet players who are ignoring GvG. I mean, a lot. We can't know why, but we don't really need to in the context of this discussion. Fact is that they don't and Inno is treating that feature accordingly.
iPenguinPat
Well-Known Member
Just a tick over 700 players surveyed. Half only do it for the rewards. Less than 10% do it just for fun. Would love to see the participation rate for gbg too. Outside of the diamond league, seems pretty dead. Even in gold leagues, it's pretty common for many sectors to never get captured even once - and it only takes 1 person trying to flip a sector a day (usually).
Only 3% of my over 1000 surveyed spend more than $1000/year on Forge. That's such a small % of the player base, maybe inno should ignore them too?
Not a very strong argument, it is?
Agent327
Well-Known Member
Correct it isn't.
700 on a total of over 50 million players does not mean a thing. Besides that, your survey target is not representative of all players at all. Majority of players does just play the game. They can not be bothered by the forum, Youtube, Facebook or Discord. If I do the same survey in my Guild I would get much different results.
I do not agree with you is it so much more fun either. Same as in GBG, Guilds are killing it. Large parts of the map can not even be played cause they are blocked off. That is supposed to be fun? Why don't you do a survey on that and see what results you would get.
Graviton
Well-Known Member
Well no, you're making assumptions about that single question that are not in evidence. The question is about rewards, not fun. You cannot assume that "I want to help my guild" and "I would fight a lot less" all equal "it's not fun". The only answer which we can assume equals "not fun" is "I only do it for the rewards". You'd need a poll question that specifically asks, "Do you find GBG to be fun?" to form conclusions about fun.
That would help with a direct comparison, sure, but it wouldn't shed any more light on GvG participation.
Nothing is a strong argument when you remove all context from it and then try to apply it to something completely different. That's a strawman argument at best.
Algona
Well-Known Member
50 million currently active or total registered accounts over time? i found a reference (search for how many people play FoE ) to that number that dates back to 2017. Has INNO updated it since?
How about something substantive from INNO? Like this:
"We have a total of 2,130,724 accounts across 26 worlds with 311,043 daily active players."
NOTE WELL! That is just US and 2018 statisitcs. I'd give something more recent, but we haven't been given anything more recent here on the forum. I think.
From a third party INNO approved site we see as of 4-25-21 192,000 active players on the US Server.
Somebody could go to the server for each country and add up the number of active players. Somebody already did in 2018, the total was under 900,000 active users world wide.
Players can check their own world Global Rankings then multiply by 26 to get some range of what might be out there. Note what makes up the bottom half of the rankings.
So while there may be 50M or more total registered users in the history of this game, I suspect the number of active unique players across all the world to be about 1-2% of that amount.
Or heck, how about CMT post the real numbers?
Just kidding.
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I suspect if someone wanted they could poke holes in the methodology of IPenguinPat's surveys.
That 50M number ain't one of the problems.
Instead we actually have someone, some place with something that looks like data of some sort.
Flawed? Liekly. To the point of not being trustworthy? I can't say.
But it's a lot better then anything we've ever gotten from INNO or anyone regarding what pplayers think about the game.
Instead of summarily dismissing it, maybe at least a few questions could be asked about how the surveys were done and if the techniques used might allow for reasonable conclusions?
Graviton
Well-Known Member
Well, that's just it. One thing, as I pointed out, is that an attempt was made to answer the question, "Is GBG fun?" by using the answer to a completely different question, "Would you still play if rewards were removed?".
The reasonable conclusion from that survey question is that very nearly half of all GBG players would cease to play it if rewards were removed. 'Cause, you know, that's exactly the answer that they selected. That doesn't mean that some portion of them don't have fun, it just means they are primarily motivated by the rewards. Which begs the comparison: what game feature do players do "just for fun" that do not give rewards? I'd wager the answer to that is "there aren't any", because everything gives rewards.
I can't say that a survey size of nearly 800 players is representative of a million active players. It might be, statistically-speaking, I just don't know. I think it probably works for the question that was posed and the answers that were given as choices. But a proper analysis of a survey depends very heavily on 1) the exact wording of the question and 2) the exact wording of the answers available (as well as other factors such as the demographic information of the surveyed). If you want the answer to a question you must include in your survey that question.
As someone much smarter than me said:
We can probably draw some conclusions from the posted survey question, but not the one that's being drawn here. And still it would not address the point that the post was meant to counter: that GvG is not popular, for whatever reason, and will get no love from Inno. Is it not popular because it has received no love from Inno? Maybe. Maybe not. That would be a good survey question: "Why don't you play GvG?"
ArrowsOfTime
Active Member
its even worse on the new worlds on these servers, the newer, the less gvg it is
Emberguard
Well-Known Member
In other words there’s too many options and/or it’s using leading questions/answers which prevents it from being a proper picture.
My main concern about the results is your audience will depend on your target market. If a lot of the people that follow whatever channel that is are predominantly a particular playstyle or mindset and less of the other playstyles that are in the game then your results are going to only really represent that kind of playstyle.
The number of 700+ is impressive and does indicate something, but lacks details on what kinds of players those 700 represent
For myself? It’d really depend on how removing rewards changes the game dynamics as to whether or not I’d want to keep playing GBG. The most fun part for me isn’t so much the rewards, it’s when you have other players in the guild working with you at the same time. GBG at the start I found fun because you had to use strategy to counter the enemy and you were still figuring those strategies out. There’s strategy now sure, but it’s already been figured out to the fine details. Remove the rewards and you may still get checkers anyway because it’s so effective for winning and the top two guilds don’t need to destroy each other to win
I’d love to see those figures for this time last year actually. Cause Covid did cause a explosion of activity from people having more free time but if that increased activity is a artificial inflation due to Covid then you’re also going to expect a dramatic dropoff afterwards (I don’t know if we’ve had that dropoff or not). Particularly if the extra time then disappears as players go back to work OR players reach in a significantly shorter time the same point they would have quit normally due to being able to spend more time on the game.
Interestingly the biggest problem I’ve come across as a player that causes a group of people to suddenly lose interest in GBG or the game is when there’s a fight either internally or cross-guild in regards to alliances and taking provinces. If GvG was more active you likely would have the exact same issue there as well. Whether it’d be as intense or frequent I don’t know. But if the biggest reason for people to stay is the social aspects then it’s also going to be the biggest reason to leave if it goes sour
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EnamIccug
Member
You can see those figures for this time last year. From MTG's (majority owner of Innogames) quarterly report, you'll see a huge explosion in MAU for Q1/Q2 2020 (in line with when Covid-related lockdowns came into effect and were sustained into the early summer). You'll then see MAU plummet in Q3/Q4 2020 (when lockdowns began to relax and things went more "back to normal"), all the way back down to (and in the case of Q3 2020, even below) Q4 2019 numbers.
