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UnREFINED Goods ?

TroyEdward

Member
Just noticed on all my Great Buildings that have a 24 Hour Supply production.... they now say "From the Modern Era on, produces 24 Unrefined Goods"

What is an Unrefined Good?
 

DeletedUser4844

It's a colonial age good. Instead of producing x modern age goods, GBs for people who reach the modern age now produxe 2x colonial age goods. Colonial age goods, however, are needed to make modern age goods, so those are considered "unrefined" goods.
 

DeletedUser

Hi!
smile.png

There is clearly a lot of confusion among our community, because of the new goods system. Some of players seem to be lost. It obviously needs a little more explaining, so I will try to go into bit more detail and provide examples. In an effort to make sure that everybody knows what's going on.
So here we go.

In previous ages stuff was easy. A good was produced in a specific good building, wishing well or a Great Building and it was always a good from the player's age. Good production in a good building was not free: coins and supplies were the price. We could produce more of it or less of it, depending if we had a good deposit on the map which could boost our good's production. There were two random boosters per era on the map.
So that was easy.


Now we go to Modern Era in which things get complicated a bit (really, just a little bit!):
We still have goods buildings in which we can produce Modern Era goods. These goods are: ferroconcrete, flavorants, luxury materials, convenience food and packaging. Just like in previous ages, each good belongs to one of ME goods buildings.

And just like in previous ages, each good's production has its price. The only difference here is that apart from coins and supplies we also have to pay Colonial Age good to start Modern Era good's production (different goods in different good buildings). For example to start production of convenience food we have to pay coins, supplies and coffee. Of course you need to have coffee produced first, it's not enough to have a map deposit. If you have no coffee - you simply can't produce convenience food.

Of course, just like in all previous ages, each Modern Era good production can be boosted thanks to map deposit! As you know, this is not mandatory to produce a good, but helps a lot. The thing is that there is no Modern Era goods deposits on map. Modern Era uses Bronze Age goods deposits to boost goods' production. Let's use convenience food as an example again. To boost convenience food production, we need grapes on the map. Yes, grapes from Bronze Age!
smile.png
They not only boost wine production in Vineyard, but also convenience food production in Food Processing Plant.

You will however notice, that there are two good deposits on the Modern Era map. As I mentioned before, there are no Modern Era map deposits. That's true: what you will find there are one Colonial Age deposit and one Bronze Age deposit which will allow you to produce CA goods and ME goods more effectively.

To sum up: To produce Modern Era good you need coins, supplies and Colonial Age good in your storage. To boost Modern Era good production you need Bronze Age good deposit on the map (you don't need to have BA good produced).
Also do not forget that once you enter Modern Era, your Wishing Wells and Great Buildings will not produce Modern Era goods just like that. They will produce Colonial Age goods instead. Amount of produced goods will double though.


I hope this explination is helpful and eliminates some of the confusion.

added to the announcement section.
http://forum.us.forgeofempires.com/showthread.php?5306-The-Modern-Era!-Change-Log-1-17
 

DeletedUser5351

Thanks for the summary. The question I have is will the MA goods deposits be different then what we already have or is there a chance we could end up with the same good deposit in both BA/CA and MA (i.e. grapes in BA and grapes in MA)?
 

DeletedUser2145

You cannot end up having the same boost on both maps. If you already have grapes as a boost from BA, then that boost is applied in both BA and MA. So your MA map would include a different boost.
 

DeletedUser3549

What I want to know is will our MA deposits/boosts fit with the boosts we already have?

What I mean is we need Coffee to build Convenience food. I don't produce coffee because I don't have a deposit for it. So is there a chance that I will get MA boosts for Convenience food even though I don't produce coffee? Is the coffee needed every time we want to produce goods or is it only needed to build the building?

If it's needed every time I want to produce goods then I would constantly be having to trade for it or have to produce a good I don't have a deposit for.

Am I understanding this right?
 

DeletedUser4844

No, they are not automatically matched, and yes, you need the coffee every time you make convenience food. If you don't have a goods deposit for coffee but do have the goods deposit for convenience food (grapes) then you will probably have to trade for coffee.

I am in a similar situation when it comes to flavorants as I do have the goods deposit for flavorants (flowers), but not the goods deposit for tar which is needed to make flavorants. I have been busy producing paper, which I do have a goods deposti for, and trading it for tar.
 

DeletedUser

And what many of us are doing, is (as usual) only focusing on making boosted production buildings, but also making our boosted Colonial Age goods. Then I can trade my boosted Colonial aged (unrefined) goods for the Wire and Paper I need for Concrete and Packaging production (which i have boosts for). I actually like the increased emphasis on trade and teamwork within the guild!
 

DeletedUser4035

Yea if you ask me I think this is a load of bs. I did not use goods buildings relying solely on my GB's for goods. Fresh off a grinding rebuild not too long ago now I must either do it again or just be stuck sitting in the early portions of the modern era.
 

DeletedUser8420

I am in the modern era and it is so frustrating I am thinking of quitting the game. The situation with the goods production is maddening. In my neighborhood and friends list, it seems we all have the same boosts and therefore need the same items we don't produce. Those that do have them wont let go of the items because they are too hard to come by. I am stuck on the tech tree because the goods needed I cannot get. I am stuck on quests for the same friggin reason. One quest is 200 of each good ....yeah right, hundreds are needed for the tech tree as well. I have three tech items paid for (Fps) but cant get the blasted modern age goods to open them. As I have heard from several other people, Modern age isn't worth the trouble. The developers need to go back with the Great Buildings offering the goods from the age you are in instead of this crap of giving unrefined goods. :mad:We can trade for the earlier age goods instead of this situation they have put us in with the modern age.
 

DeletedUser2145

An easy solution to that is to increase your friends list with players who have different goods boosts and would also benefit from trading with you. Simply asking on chat from time to time should resolve your situation.

The best scenario would be to join a guild with other players of the same or higher age. Either way, communication and interaction with other players is the key here.
 

DeletedUser8796

This is the reason i thus-far have refused to go to ME; PE goods are hard enough to get in decent numbers (mostly Gasoline ).
I have been sitting at the end of PE for a while debating on going forward, BUT going there would only make higher age goods (which can be hard to get) even HARDER to get. With GvG being added any decent goods are being held and hoarded by greedy bankers and once you hit PE and up there is a significant bottle neck in players at those ages. The only reason i see the GB's giving "unrefined goods" is to slow us down in progressing on techs.
 

DeletedUser8152

I'd like to understand this issue better. I thought that there weren't any boosts for modern itself, you just need the CA goods to convert? If that's right, it seems like trading for the CA goods you need shouldn't be so hard. If that's not right, how does it work?
 

DeletedUser10076

I'd like to understand this issue better. I thought that there weren't any boosts for modern itself, you just need the CA goods to convert? If that's right, it seems like trading for the CA goods you need shouldn't be so hard. If that's not right, how does it work?

Your BA boosts also boost your ME production. Example the goods deposit rock boosts stone and ferroconcrete. Ferroconcrete cost the CA good wire to produce. So really you need the boost of stone AND nickel to produce ferroncrete in large numbers.

The problem certainly is not the unrefined goods, with my gbs im producing 140 a day and will likely use the CA good as rewards for lvling up my gbs.

The problem comes from the getting the ME/PME goods themselves
1. Many refuse to age up(I don't blame them, I mean come on even the Wishing Well gives unrefined goods that is super lame)
2. Some have a rough time understanding the system. No matter what age you STILL have peeps that build unboosted goods. Expecting them to understand a three step process is a little much.
3. What goods are created go to GvG.

This has created a shortage and simply put yes its obvious they are trying to slow us down(im thinking only two more ages now)

All of that said here are my thoughts on the system itself:

I played this game long ago when there were no gbs, you had to trade, plunder, produce your goods and back then sometime(although rare) you HAD to bite the bullet and build unboosted. Goods production itself had become FAR too easy with gbs, and I believe the unrefined system helps bring back the struggle needed to advance......However; there can be no doubt that players are essentially being punished for simply advancing to these Ages. Due to this the system must be reworked several ideas have come up.

1. One proposal which already passed. Asked our gbs to produce "current age" goods. (Slightly different topic, but it would be nice if got a yes on our proposal from the devs)
2. Reduce the good costs of techs in these era.
3. Completely remove and the unrefined system.
 

DeletedUser8152

Right, I remember now. So for instance to make convenience food you need to supply coffee and you want to be boosted in wine. Sounds like getting the coffee is easy enough whether you are boosted in it or not, you can just trade with CA people (or rely on GB/well production). So the boost you care about is wine. You start off with two of those boosts, and eventually get a third. So you can make three of the five goods relatively easily.

You're saying the problem is that it's hard to get the other two, because people don't trade?
 

DeletedUser10076

Right, I remember now. So for instance to make convenience food you need to supply coffee and you want to be boosted in wine. Sounds like getting the coffee is easy enough whether you are boosted in it or not, you can just trade with CA people (or rely on GB/well production). So the boost you care about is wine. You start off with two of those boosts, and eventually get a third. So you can make three of the five goods relatively easily.

You're saying the problem is that it's hard to get the other two, because people don't trade? But surely they too are missing a couple and need to trade?

Well of course they do, but really how many are there? Also how many are like Shady and refuse to move up? I seriously considered calling my tech progress done at the end of PE, but then i say how pretty ME units are and I said,"I want". My guess is that for everyone that decides to progress, two or three stop progressing. Considering that it takes at least 6 month to a year to get in that position anyway, we're not talking about a large number of players to begin with. Those that have power through these ages are little big spenders and will horde these good to funds thier efforts in GvG.

Worse as i've aready stated players are punished for advancing. Take for example my st.marks. Was producing 20 PE goods a day, now produces 40 CA. Technically coin and supply wise im coming out ahead, 21 to 35 PE to CA under fair thade rules. But realistically only a fool, or somebody in dire need would give 20 PE for 40 CA. I wouldn't thats for sure.
 

DeletedUser8152

OK, so one issue is that there just aren't enough people in ME to easily trade for the goods you need. In part, you feel that is because the GB effect makes people not want to enter ME.

I wonder if it would work better and still achieve the same ends if the GBs just kept producing PE goods. For instance, you keep producing the same amount of PE goods, but also produce some CA goods. Like if you were getting 13 PE goods in PE, when you move to modern you get 13 PE + 13 CA. Then in PME you get 13 PE + 13 Inda, and in contemp you get 26 PE.

That way you do get some benefit from aging up, and the benefit does apply to the age you are going in to.
 
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DeletedUser8796

This is one of the things in the game that was made with a good purpose but that purpose however useful it was intended to be is a pain. Why not make it so once you hit CA the GB's give you 2x the BA goods?
 

DeletedUser10076

Thats essentially what they did shady.

Something along those lines could work Jaelis.
 

DeletedUser8420

Easy solution???? Are you kidding me? I have an extensive friends list (with several of them with points values in the 1,000,000's) and it still is a major pain in the rear with the Modern Age. They were all available for trades UNTIL I started asking for Modern age goods. Trying to get people to trade the hard to find goods is like pulling a wisdom tooth with your fingers. I have asked, I have tried to sweeten the trade (ie throwing dozens of Fps into their GBs) as much as possible and still I am finding it near impossible. Especially with the quests and tech tree needing 100's of the items in order to complete them, ie, gather 200 of each of the Modern Age goods. And as stated, I have three tech paid for and am stuck for the same reason cant get the Modern age goods to open the tech item. All I can do is sit and wait until someone throws a trade up and grab it before anyone else does...those are few and far between and then not in the volume needed. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
 
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