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When can we stop pretending GBG is balanced?

Helmet Bro

New Member
Here is a screenshot of our current GBG map in diamond league 1 hour after GBG opened. Before giving my thoughts, I'm going to start a hashtag called #InnoBalance:

When your 2nd grader reaches the final round in the school spelling bee and has to beat an English professor #InnoBalance

When the state championship football game is a local varsity team vs the KC Chiefs #InnoBalance

When you're in the final round of an interview and your last task is to defend a PhD Thesis #InnoBalance

When your niece/nephew asks you to help them study their multiplication tables so you hit 'em with a little calculus instead #InnoBalance

Come on now, let's either make an apex league or make diamond the apex league and only allow the top 7-8 guilds in. If you're one of the bottom 2 GBG guilds for a season, you're out for the next season and the top 2 Plat guilds move in. This isn't hard, there are a ton of games with apex ranking systems that you can copy.
 

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Emberguard

Senior Ingame Moderator
Come on now, let's either make an apex league or make diamond the apex league and only allow the top 7-8 guilds in. If you're one of the bottom 2 GBG guilds for a season, you're out for the next season and the top 2 Plat guilds move in. This isn't hard, there are a ton of games with apex ranking systems that you can copy.
You mean,,,,, exactly what happens currently?
 

Helmet Bro

New Member
You mean,,,,, exactly what happens currently?
I mean a single diamond league for each world, not 40+ guilds sitting in diamond where you have 7 different diamond GBGs going on simultaneously every 2 weeks. 7-8 guilds in diamond total, everyone else should be plat and below. On my world we have 42 guilds in diamond this round, and as it's plainly obvious in my original post that should not be the case.
 

Helmet Bro

New Member
I'll admit, it's interesting to hear complaints about imbalance from a player who's seemingly on the favorable side of the situation (the sectors are white, which means they belong to the one taking the screenshot).
It's not fun to be significantly stronger than everyone you're matched against, no more than it is for them to face a guild they can't beat.

Also worth noting - a weak GBG round will cost us more in terms of lost fights (since they can't flip sectors) than we will gain in terms of finishing first. That's the other frustration aside from it's just boring to pick on weaker guilds.
 

Airtaz

New Member
Not sure what the problem here is, other than all enemies didn't even attempt to leave their base.
 

Lil Hooper

Active Member
I personally have lost all hope in GbG
on the topic of hard truths people avoid, GbG was designed to replace GvG. It's a GvG that everybody can do and it gives rewards... enough to make the more selfish players quit GvG or cut back a lot.
fortunately for GvG lovers like me, unfortunately for Inno, that didn't happen. GbG has turned into a game of checkers. No competition (except when GvG enemies get placed against each other). It's not Battlegrounds any more, it's farmgrounds. Inno didn't intend for all of this map gridding when they made GbG, so how do they solve the new problem of guilds not competing against each other and instead farming rewards alongside each other? They put guilds who can't or won't farm the map alongside guilds who love to fight for the points and rewards so that the checkerboard GbG model wont work out. They've also done things like reducing building slots on some tiles to try to impede the gridding.
So in conclusion, @Helmet Bro , don't be surprised that inno does this. They are trying to reverse the farming and bring the battle back to battlegrounds. Because right now, victory points are taking backseat to rewards and farming. Thats my 2 cents :)
 

Falconwing

Well-Known Member
If you are in Diamond and losing, what are you complaining about? Your in DIAMOND!!! The big leagues. You are getting better personal rewards and the Guild gets more Crowns. The last place Guild in Diamond gets more than the 1st place Guild in Platinum and so on. You should be happy you're sitting with the adults and not at the kiddie table.

Think of it this way, you can be a losing team in the Professional sports league and get the professional paycheck, or you can be kicking butt in double A and making minimum wage.
 

Helmet Bro

New Member
If you are in Diamond and losing, what are you complaining about? Your in DIAMOND!!! The big leagues. You are getting better personal rewards and the Guild gets more Crowns. The last place Guild in Diamond gets more than the 1st place Guild in Platinum and so on. You should be happy you're sitting with the adults and not at the kiddie table.

Think of it this way, you can be a losing team in the Professional sports league and get the professional paycheck, or you can be kicking butt in double A and making minimum wage.
The screenshot is white sectors, meaning I'm on the WINNING team. Your analogy is incorrect, what would be more correct is my guild is Julio Jones being paid like Brandon Powell.
 

Helmet Bro

New Member
Which would ultimately keep the exact same opponents due to score
I'm not sure what you're saying, the implication is my guild belongs in diamond while the others do not. This is the case across many worlds where a top GBG guild is not facing a single strong competitor and the simple solution is to make it so there is only a single Diamond league or a Diamond+ league where ONLY the top 7 GBG guilds can compete. The bottom 2 of each round get demoted, and the top 2 guilds from Platinum should be promoted to diamond for the next round. You could do this with the bottom 3 guilds in diamond to force players to consider placement rather than just farming rewards, but Inno's current ranking system is flawed since too many guilds are allowed in the top tier so you have farmville rather than an actual battleground. Basically, Inno created a system where there are 10 strong GBG guilds, but too many weaker guilds are in diamond, so Inno's "fix" was to separate those 10 guilds as much as possible to deny them rewards rather than incentivizing them to compete.

It's strange that this is a problem since there are games older than FOE that have already solved this issue with competitive ladders, Inno is just unable or unwilling to fix the problem.
 

Helmet Bro

New Member
I personally have lost all hope in GbG
on the topic of hard truths people avoid, GbG was designed to replace GvG. It's a GvG that everybody can do and it gives rewards... enough to make the more selfish players quit GvG or cut back a lot.
fortunately for GvG lovers like me, unfortunately for Inno, that didn't happen. GbG has turned into a game of checkers. No competition (except when GvG enemies get placed against each other). It's not Battlegrounds any more, it's farmgrounds. Inno didn't intend for all of this map gridding when they made GbG, so how do they solve the new problem of guilds not competing against each other and instead farming rewards alongside each other? They put guilds who can't or won't farm the map alongside guilds who love to fight for the points and rewards so that the checkerboard GbG model wont work out. They've also done things like reducing building slots on some tiles to try to impede the gridding.
So in conclusion, @Helmet Bro , don't be surprised that inno does this. They are trying to reverse the farming and bring the battle back to battlegrounds. Because right now, victory points are taking backseat to rewards and farming. Thats my 2 cents :)
I think you hit the nail on the head. Inno screwed up their own system, and their "fix" is to separate strong guilds so we can't farm instead of, oh I don't know, maybe fixing the system. Rather than trying that, their logic is to dilute the pool entirely so enough "filler" guilds exist to deny the strong guilds.

A simple fix would be to shift the rewards toward the chests by increasing chest payout and decreasing fighting rewards.
 

Emberguard

Senior Ingame Moderator
This is the case across many worlds where a top GBG guild is not facing a single strong competitor and the simple solution is to make it so there is only a single Diamond league or a Diamond+ league where ONLY the top 7 GBG guilds can compete.
What I’m saying is the guilds are already arranged top to bottom in order of score. So there’d be very little change if the score continued beyond 1,000 to allow only 7 guilds because those at 1,000 are all on the same island(s) and everyone below 1,000 is arranged in order of score.
 

Mustapha00

Well-Known Member
If you've been around long enough, you'll remember that Inno used to have a completely random assortment of players in Neighborhoods, without any regard to the Age players were in. I think maybe Arctic Future was the latest Age when I started playing, and I'd find myself, in Iron Age or maybe in one of the Middle Ages, in the same Neighborhood with Arctic Future players. Needless to say, you hoped that the upper end players didn't think us Lowbies worth the time to attack and plunder on a daily basis (although some did).

Some time later, Inno implemented a "fix" in which all players in a Neighborhood are in the same game Age (and I think at roughly the same point on the Tech Tree within an Age- but not sure about that). I think, overall, that was a good fix.

It would appear that Inno learned from their past mistake and try to group Guilds which tend to be roughly equal in terms of GBG success in the same league level rather than merely have their RNG select entirely random Guilds to compete against each other.

But, even within the top Diamond League, there are top Guilds and then there are Top Guilds. Short of creating a Level above Diamond, what can Inno do to balance things? And even if they did have a Double Diamond League, you'd almost certainly have a similar hierarchy as you do now, so would anything really be "better"?
 

Vger

Well-Known Member
If you are in Diamond and losing, what are you complaining about? c The big leagues. You are getting better personal rewards and the Guild gets more Crowns.
It's certainly true that the chest rewards are better in diamond, even if you come in last. But who is doing GBG for the chest rewards?

It isn't always true that you are getting better personal rewards.

Sure, 10 FPs is better than 7. And 25 diamonds is better than 20. But which is better: 500 chances to earn 7 FP, or 50 chances to earn 10 FP?
I tend to earn more rewards when we are in Platinum or the very bottom of Diamond. Hitting 1,000 usually means take a season off. Watch the big boys play checkers and grab whatever meager rewards you can as they run past the front porch. Not complaining about it, but "Your in DIAMOND!!!" is not always a good thing.