Alcatraz or Albatross?

[WillyTwoShoes]

I was looking over the stats on some of the recent event builds that have been offered and noticed that a lot of them offer significant troop drops each collection. With that in mind and putting aside for the moment whatever "Guild Raids" might look like -

Is the GB - Alcatraz becoming an unnecessary waste of city space?

 

[Dursland]

Considering none of those buildings produce the hundreds of rogues I need daily Alcatraz will be sticking around for a while.

I easily lose dozens of hovers and 100+ rogues, fighting from 100 to 125 attrition - nevermind the troops I lose getting to 100 in the first place.

 

[Pericles the Lion]

I removed Traz from a city where I use advanced units with rogues. Otherwise, I'm keeping it for the same reason that @Dursland mentioned. If you do any serious fighting in GBG the Traz is necessary. Especially in SAT.

 

[Ironrooster]

For now I am keeping my Traz because it produces the type of unit I use the most.

But as I get more and more buildings that produce units it will become redundant. Currently, Traz produces 42 units and other buildings 43 units. When that gets somewhere above 100 units from other buildings, then Traz will be gone.

 

[Pericles the Lion]

For now I am keeping my Traz because it produces the type of unit I use the most.

But as I get more and more buildings that produce units it will become redundant. Currently, Traz produces 42 units and other buildings 43 units. When that gets somewhere above 100 units from other buildings, then Traz will be gone.

Be careful. I don't know what era you're in but, in the Space Ages, using only one type of unit is very common. It's not difficult to burn thru a lot of of them in GBG which means 100 random units (20 of the desired units) won't be enough.

 

[Emberguard]

Is the GB - Alcatraz becoming an unnecessary waste of city space?

Depends on how well developed your city is, your needs as a player, what you're looking for and whether you're willing to rotate between different units.

If you're relying on random unit production you're going to have a lot of "junk" units. It's a good idea to choose some things to use the "junk" on so you can prioritise your best units on the things you really need them for.

I tend to use the "junk" as cannon fodder on PvP Arena, the Map and experimenting on high attrition in Guild Battlegrounds if my best units are starting to struggle to beat a combination

 

[Johnny B. Goode]

For myself (only), I plan on stopping most of my cities in Future Era. Two are already past that. The ones that I will stop in FE, I will have a Traz until I get to FE and have several thousand Hovers and over 30k Rogues. Then I will probably delete the Traz in that city to make space for event buildings. Not sure what I'll do in the two that are past FE. One is my main (AF) and one is a Diamond farm (SAM).

 

[MJ Artisan of War]

Depends on how well developed your city is, your needs as a player, what you're looking for and whether you're willing to rotate between different units.

If you're relying on random unit production you're going to have a lot of "junk" units. It's a good idea to choose some things to use the "junk" on so you can prioritise your best units on the things you really need them for.

I tend to use the "junk" as cannon fodder on PvP Arena, the Map and experimenting on high attrition in Guild Battlegrounds if my best units are starting to struggle to beat a combination

I use the "junk" units in low attrition gbg fights....
On the three days that gbg isn't available they get to meet the hoodies....

 

[Xenosaur]

I was looking over the stats on some of the recent event builds that have been offered and noticed that a lot of them offer significant troop drops each collection. With that in mind and putting aside for the moment whatever "Guild Raids" might look like -

Is the GB - Alcatraz becoming an unnecessary waste of city space?

Me... albatrosss. Never had one. @Dursland and others make valid points TO have one for deep sustained, immersive fighting at levels of attrition I don't yet achieve, is plausible.

But I think your point is more about this:

The count of players that don't intrinsically need one has grown substantially, vs the count that truly do.
The count of players not building one and seeking event buildings for warriors, has grown substantially.
The count of players asking the same question you did, has grown substantially.
The count of people razing their TRAZ @ level X, and going "warrior commando in other ways", has grown appreciably? sizeably? minimally? Takes a lot of "intestinal fortitude" to raze any GB, especially one so controversial for the decision.

It's certainly on people's radar as a city decision - more than ever before, yes.

 

[Johnny B. Goode]

Me... albatrosss. Never had one. @Dursland and others make valid points TO have one for deep sustained, immersive fighting at levels of attrition I don't yet achieve, is plausible.

But I think your point is more about this:

The count of players that don't intrinsically need one has grown substantially, vs the count that truly do.
The count of players not building one and seeking event buildings for warriors, has grown substantially.
The count of players asking the same question you did, has grown substantially.
The count of people razing their TRAZ @ level X, and going "warrior commando in other ways", has grown sizeably.

It's certainly on people's radar as a city decision - more than ever before, yes.

I will say, in addition to my earlier post, that in my lower era cities I am not building it until Progressive Era for the most part. Mostly due to Rogues being more available in small quantities (enough for lower era light fighting, at least) from other sources than the Rogue Hideout/Alcatraz combo. Not to mention lack of space in earlier eras. (And even in PE it's a stretch to fit it in, with all the event/special buildings.)

 

[Be Chuille]

I will say, in addition to my earlier post, that in my lower era cities I am not building it until Progressive Era for the most part. Mostly due to Rogues being more available in small quantities (enough for lower era light fighting, at least) from other sources than the Rogue Hideout/Alcatraz combo. Not to mention lack of space in earlier eras. (And even in PE it's a stretch to fit it in, with all the event/special buildings.)

I agree that Traz does not seem efficient in the early eras. Some push IA age players to get Traz. I find that the troops produced by barracks in IA are more efficient for the space. They heal fast and more can be produced daily in the same space with barracks as a lower level Traz.

Traz is critical when doing GvG, for fast production of various era troops. I am debating if it will be as useful with no GvG.

 

[Sharmon the Impaler]

In SAT the Power Washers are useless but place first on the list so you have to delete them as they come in. In SAT Champions are the same thing , the orbiter things will die every second fight because they can't fight flying. Orbitors make the heavies useless. This leaves Perma Frost and guess which ones are "randomly" made the least of ? They then intentionally added the scrambled units as you fight making it just a mess to deal with. Then even if you get through that dumpster fire you have the moving odds to deal with. 11 fights and 8 attrition , 4 units lost and that is from 0 attrition and 4500 attack boost. Just bad luck though right ? I just have to take a bigger sample and it will all "balance out" , right ? How about tracking the past 6 weeks of fighting rounds and only on 80% supported sectors and never getting lower than the stated attrition expected but always higher after 28,718 fights. Never one round where it was 80% and ending a round with less than the 80% but 100% of the time it always being higher. Doesn't sound very random to me.

 

[Pericles the Lion]

In SAT the Power Washers are useless but place first on the list so you have to delete them as they come in. In SAT Champions are the same thing , the orbiter things will die every second fight because they can't fight flying. Orbitors make the heavies useless. This leaves Perma Frost and guess which ones are "randomly" made the least of ? They they added the scrambled units as you fight making it just a mess to deal with. Then even if you get through that dumpster fire you have the moving odds to deal with. 11 fights and 8 attrition , 4 units lost and that is from 0 attrition and 4500 attack boost. Just bad luck though right ? I just have to take a bigger sample and it will all "balance out" , right ? How about tracking the past 6 weeks of fighting rounds and only on 80% supported sectors and never getting lower than the stated attrition expected but always higher after 28,718 fights. Never one round where it was 80% and ending a round with less than the 80% but 100% of the time it always being higher. Doesn't sound very random to me.

We're both in SAT, your boosts are a bit higher than mine but, according to you that should not make any difference. 28,718 fights in 6 weeks. 684 fights per day average (more if you're talking about GBG fights only). Fighting on only 20% sectors, this means that your getting to 137 attrition each day (again, more if your 6 weeks is actually 3 GBG seasons or 36 days). I can get to 115 attrition with auto-battle and I stop there. Manual is too tedious. I don't know what you're complaining about. It sounds like the attrition calculation is working just fine.

 

[Ironrooster]

Be careful. I don't know what era you're in but, in the Space Ages, using only one type of unit is very common. It's not difficult to burn thru a lot of of them in GBG which means 100 random units (20 of the desired units) won't be enough.

As I think about it, I think you're right. I'm in SAT and use mostly Drones, which is what my Traz produces.

 

[WillyTwoShoes]

Now that QI has replaced GVG. I have to revisit my original question.

Is the GB - Alcatraz becoming an unnecessary waste of city space?
Has the GB - Alcatraz become a waste of city space?

 

[Sharmon the Impaler]

Now that QI has replaced GVG. I have to revisit my original question.

Is the GB - Alcatraz becoming an unnecessary waste of city space?
Has the GB - Alcatraz become a waste of city space?

Why didn't you simply read the last answer before you posted this question ? It's been answered ad nauseum and GVG going doesn't affect the why they should stay at all. If you don't do GBG then delete it , if you do GBG then keep it.

 

[WillyTwoShoes]

Why didn't you simply read the last answer before you posted this question ? It's been answered ad nauseum and GVG going doesn't affect the why they should stay at all. If you don't do GBG then delete it , if you do GBG then keep it.

I have read all the posts and excepting the age specific troops that GVG needed I am struggling to see the relevant need in GBG anymore. I'm taking this from the perspective that any player with a common sense GBG approach is going to accumulate enough troops over the course of a couple months that what the Alcatraz provides vs its footprint is perhaps outdated strategy?

Or to put it another way.... if your losing all the troops an Alcatraz produces each day in GBG maybe your wasting troops? For myself its a rare occurrence that I lose more troops than I gain in each GBG session before attrition makes it a zero sum gain. My event buildings provide the bulk of my troops anymore and I haven't lacked for the go to troops for a very very long time.

One thing I do appreciate is the speed at which an Alcatraz can produce troops (given a good guild buff) but even that has grown passe with all the troops event buildings are producing - never mind emissary's, quest rewards, etc.

I can't and wouldn't argue Dursland's post about the Alcatraz and Rogue production. That is perhaps the only decent reason I can see to keep one hanging around taking up city space. With that I have to ask, is that what the Alcatraz is, a Rogue producer?

 

[Ebeondi Asi]

Fighting in Gbg while residing in Space Age Titan, and actually doing 130 attrition each day means I kill off 300 to 500 troops a day. there is no place to get enough replacement troops except Alcatraz. And even then it is hard to keep up. The main saving grace are slow GbG seasons. If I stuck to 100 attrition it would not be as bad.. But I can reach 150 attrition autobattling, just the troop loss is staggering and unsustainable. My three World Traz are around level 120 now.
In some lower ages players seem to be able to drop Traz.

 

[Sharmon the Impaler]

Fighting in Gbg while residing in Space Age Titan, and actually doing 130 attrition each day means I kill off 300 to 500 troops a day. there is no place to get enough replacement troops except Alcatraz. And even then it is hard to keep up. The main saving grace are slow GbG seasons. If I stuck to 100 attrition it would not be as bad.. But I can reach 150 attrition autobattling, just the troop loss is staggering and unsustainable. My three World Traz are around level 120 now.
In some lower ages players seem to be able to drop Traz.

Exactly , I am in SAT with a 125 Traz and it still isn't enough to have more than 2 back to back all out GBG seasons. I started with 22,000 Permafrost drones after taking a 3 month hiatus to build everything up. I now have 967. If you fight hard in the space ages then you need a Traz period and 120+ at that. SAT is the worst example with all but one unit being utter trash. but even the earlier space ages were nerfed to a lesser extent by inno.

 

[Darkest.Knight]

I've been accumulating units really quickly these days, been considering removing TRAZ for some time. After I check all the units again for usefulness I'll decide; in addition to Permafrost I quite like Pressurizers and Orbiters.