Changelog 1.86 Feedback

[DeletedUser18976]

Giving them back their ability to retaliate would make them as good as they were before. I don't care what type they are, I'm going to use them due to their stealth regardless of what troops I'm up against, but not if they can't retaliate. Half the point of using them as stealthed units was to be able to attack and draw the enemy close, and that retaliation damage when attacked while stealthed really helped bring the enemy numbers down without being able to be attacked from most units further away. Obviously exo's and rail guns could still hit them.

I agree, slapping a new type on a unit that was originally designed to be light is sloppy. Creating a better ranged unit would be the solution, not recasting an old type just to make something else that was created w out the correct attributes fit. If dragon drones only have a range of one and were meant to be the ranged unit, then increase the range.

For the battle fortress point, it's all personal preference. I've used combos of rail guns, hover tanks, and surrogates, while sometimes throwing 8 combat drones out, and made it through encounter 44 of 48 in GE just fine. I do use fortresses when I'm up against 8 drone swarms but that's about it. I'm probably just so used to playing the stealth game that the battle fortress is worse for me due to the way I fight.

 

[DeletedUser9167]

Just speculating, but what would it take to make them worthwhile? Drop the close quarters ability, that is pointless. But I think if the range went up to say 14, they would be an effective unit.

There is no need to speculate. Put it back the way it was on live servers (surrogate = light). Tweak it in beta; that's what it's for. By convention ranged has a similar attack to heavy but lower defense. Relative range has varied a lot but it makes no sense for attack AND range to be lower for ranged than heavy. Maybe the big brains that thought up this wonderful dragon unit can come up with a new skill that makes sense.

 

[DeletedUser8152]

There is no need to speculate. Put it back the way it was on live servers (surrogate = light). Tweak it in beta; that's what it's for. By convention ranged has a similar attack to heavy but lower defense. Relative range has varied a lot but it makes no sense for attack AND range to be lower for ranged than heavy. Maybe the big brains that thought up this wonderful dragon unit can come up with a new skill that makes sense.

I found the old surrogates to be less effective than hover tanks, myself. But of course it all depends on what you're doing.

 

[DeletedUser24624]

AF3 has not yet been announced for this server, but it should be coming soon.

Thanks for lying to me.

 

[DeletedUser8152]

Sorry if that came across as misleading. Apparently there was a snafu in the announcement process, our apologies for that.

 

[DeletedUser18976]

Now that I see the dragon drone: why not have made it the fast unit since it moves further than the recon raider. Make recon raider the ranged unit by reducing its movement and increasing its range, and leave the surrogates alone and return them to the way they were. A stealth unit w no retaliation ability makes no sense.

 

[qaccy]

Ugh. That's not the point. The point is they screwed up the surrogate unit. FIX IT! Should have longer range and different skill. Why didn't they try THIS in beta?
(and for goodness sake, should we be glad/surprised a higher age Heavy has some advantage over a lower age one? It's expected)

If you notice, the post I was quoting was stating BFs were *not* good, hence the explanation. You also ignored the second half of my post, but perhaps you didn't notice that one since I edited it in afterward.

I think something as simple as dropping the close quarters and increasing their attack range would be fine for the new surrogates. They have high A/D for ranged units (compare to satellites), and stealth is good enough on its own that I don't think they'd need any other special ability. The terrain bonuses are still weird on paper since they clash with stealth, but if a unit gets in close or ignores stealth anyway then having more defense and attack can come in handy.

I still think recon raiders and dragon drones should have their types switched as well, though. Drones have been the fast unit for the previous two ages, and dragons are more mobile than raiders PLUS have the flight ability, just like the previous three ages' fast units. It makes more sense to me personally to have dragons be fast, and raiders be light units. More bonuses would have to be changed as well though, since currently drones have a bonus against heavy units and fortresses have a bonus against light units. Units cancelling each other out like that doesn't make much sense to me, either.

 

[DeletedUser18976]

I found the old surrogates to be less effective than hover tanks, myself. But of course it all depends on what you're doing.

I found them useful against the satellite spotters and drone swarms (especially if they retaliated when hit) since they would move earlier in battle than the tanks and still be stealthed on plains. They're weaker than hover tanks, but you need a good mix to get through most fights. They also tended to do more damage to rail guns than hover tanks once you got close.