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Arctic Orangery real effect on battles

Currently in the GBG I can auto battle to around 40 attrition or so before I stop due to too many troop losses.

I realize this is a question that may not be able to answered definitively, however if I changed nothing else but planted an Arctic Orangery and
used a speed leveling thread to raise it to level 80 in one hour, how much of an effect would it have on my GBG auto battle ability? 5 extra attrition, 10, 20?

Please, no that depends on your troop choices, manual, or auto or other such replies. I'm trying to decide if the benefit is worth the space, and if it only gets me a few extra attrition in the GBG it's likely not going to be worth it.
 

Ebeondi Asi

Well-Known Member
At level 84 AO should affect one in four battles (with same age troop) That is one out of each four hits will give 150% damage. with the usual (you probably would have it if you can level it to 80 at one sitting LOL) attack bonuses. the plus is one shot kill 25% of the time.
I have my several AO up to high 70's and working on getting to level 84. The daily Fps are very nice addition too. If you have the space AO is worthwhile
Personally I do not know if in your case it would slow troop loss enough. Boosting attack army defense would be more likely to cut losses of troops. the othe way is to just have more troops via Traz.
I just let the troops die when battling. I will save some injured after a few fights with no stop to fix any in autobattle. but expect to lose plenty. I also throw in the unwanted free troops and kill them off on purpose as fast as i collect them.
 

Algona

Well-Known Member
8 more attrits.

I'll wander back in a day or two and explain that answer, but you can prolly guess where I pulled it from?

Personally if i wanted an answer to that question I'd build it and find out. That's gotta be better then hoping random.poster doesn't give you a bogus answer?

Or trying to guess between differing answers or listen to me and doubtless others telling you stuff you don't want to hear and you questioning or arguing with other posters about this including telling you that your choices in troops and the Era you are in, and the defensive troop abilities can and will make a difference?

Won't you build it eventually for the FP anyway? Why not now and be the first to ever report it to the forum?

Of course then folk will tell you you didn't do that right either.

Can't wait for the similar thread on Kraken.
 

wolfhoundtoo

Well-Known Member
You aren't really giving enough information in your initial post for anyone to even try and give you an accurate answer really. The age/era of your city is going to make a rather large difference in some cases as the troops you are using will impact it greatly as some ages are better than others for fighting because of the troops available (FE springs to mind and hovers). You aren't saying what you consider to be 'to many troop losses' and of course are you replacing your troops after each auto battle?

Just a slight clarification of how the AO works as someone mentioned it working 1/4 of the time. Assuming that you can still get a 2 shot kill (which at the edge of your attrition isn't necessarily true) you get 16 shots in a battle in which the AO may work. Let's assume it does fire off 4 times remember that half of those will be 'wasted' if you were already getting a 2 shot kill. Only 2 of those 4 would really impact the battle in that case. As mentioned above before you should see about boosting your attacking defense score (if possible) and review the troop types you are using for your age as that might improve your range a bit already.
 

Ebeondi Asi

Well-Known Member
the 1/4 time is AO at level 84. Just to clarify
The comment about 16 shots and just half of he four probable on first hit is correct. As the AO is just as likely to fire on the second shot as the first.
Also to mention having a high enough attack bonus to have AO give one shot kill really is the best ..Without that Ao may seem weak to the player owning it.
And again and again reminder the player has to remember only the same era troop can use AO affect.
 

planetofthehumans2

Active Member
You should build it simply because it gives 1FP/level which is on par with the cape. So an extra 84FP/day. The attack is just a bonus. Although if you're a low era player I wouldn't advise taking up so much city space on it.

Obviously you're never going to know if the AO did make a difference if you auto all your fights. I've been seeing it work nicely in level 4 GE.
 

KungQu

Well-Known Member
You should build it simply because it gives 1FP/level which is on par with the cape. So an extra 84FP/day. The attack is just a bonus. Although if you're a low era player I wouldn't advise taking up so much city space on it.

Obviously you're never going to know if the AO did make a difference if you auto all your fights. I've been seeing it work nicely in level 4 GE.
I actually see the Forge Points as a nice bonus. The Critical Hit can be worth more Forge Points per day if you're fighting 100+ battles per day in GBG, plus there are diamond, troops and other goodies to be won. It's also an extremely useful building if you participate in GVG. Saves a lot of troops to fight another day.
 

Sherlock-Holmes2

New Member
What I have found re GBG and Attrition on the basis that there are no SC's on the sectors what I have found on average is for every 100% Attack Boost you can get about 10 Battles in before the troop loss gets unmanageable.
That means for a city with 500% Attack boost you can expect to be able to get about 50 Battles in and this is with an AO in the city which is yet to get to level 84, however not far off Level 80.
 

Kranyar the Mysterious

Well-Known Member
What I have found re GBG and Attrition on the basis that there are no SC's on the sectors what I have found on average is for every 100% Attack Boost you can get about 10 Battles in before the troop loss gets unmanageable.
That means for a city with 500% Attack boost you can expect to be able to get about 50 Battles in and this is with an AO in the city which is yet to get to level 84, however not far off Level 80.
That really depends upon the era. Early eras like Iron Age and EMA have glass ceilings, where the attrition will tend to max out around 30 even with an attack over 500. Later ages tend to do much better with being able to gain a reasonably high attrition before losing a lot of troops, but even in FE with an attack over 900/600 and a level 100 AO I still don't reach 90 attrition before loses become unmanageable. 55 attrition max for autobattle and about 75 for manual battling seems to be about par for the course for me.
 

Ebeondi Asi

Well-Known Member
What I have found re GBG and Attrition on the basis that there are no SC's on the sectors what I have found on average is for every 100% Attack Boost you can get about 10 Battles in before the troop loss gets unmanageable.
That means for a city with 500% Attack boost you can expect to be able to get about 50 Battles in and this is with an AO in the city which is yet to get to level 84, however not far off Level 80.
That may be true in your current Era. things change as you move up Eras. the percentages start to be worth less.. and then less again... But when one gets to a higher level, and have boosted your attack up, the ability to withstand attrition does go up some.
 

matr

New Member
My Arctic Orange attack bonus calculation:

AO provides 150% damage XX percent of the time. The percent is dependent on the AO level.
Attack bonus =AB
AO%= xx % of the time for 150% damage
Total attack bonus=AB+0.5xAB x AO%

To understand this, assume the AO percent was 100% percent of the time you got 150% damage. This means that you get 150% of your current attack bonus in damage done. So your attack bonus with the AO is your attack bonus x 1.50, this is not an adder because the AO does 150% DAMAGE. Now assume the percent of time you got the 150% bonus was Zero, then you attack bonus is your normal AB.

Now take the percent into consideration means you only get the 150% damage xx% of the time.
So, for a percentage of your strikes you have your normal attack bonus and a percentage of your strikes you have the AO attack bonus. Add these together for your total attack boost.

Percent you get standard is (1-AO%)
Percent you get 150% is AO%

The sum of the two is your attack bonus with an AO
Total Attack Bonus is then:

TAB=AB x (1-AO%) + ABx1.5xAO%
Simplify
TAB=AB -ABxAO% +ABx1.5xAO%
TAB= AB+ABx.5xAO%
TAB=ABx(1+.5AO%)

Total Attack bonus with AO is: TAB=ABx(1+.5xAO%)

Test with my assumptions to verify correctness:
0% of strikes = ABx (1+.5x0)= AB
100% of strikes = ABx(1+.5x1)= 1.5AB Looks correct

For me with 723 standard AB and AO of L95 (0.2835% of time get 150%)
My adder is (I used the second to last simplification so you can see how much the adder is for the AO)
723 + 723x0.50x0.2835
723 + 102.5 = 825.5
AO adds 102.5% to my attack boost. Enough for about 2 or 3 more attrition, 102 percent is huge.

Another example
AB=400, AO is level 20, 8.75%
Total attack boost with AO
400+400x.5x.0875
400+17.5 = 417.5
Only adds 17.5% probably not enough for 1 more attrition

Let’s Double AB to 800 same AO .0875
TAB= 800+.5x800x.0875 = 800+35=835 maybe enough for another attrition.

One more AB 400, AO L50 15.03%
TAB=400+.5x400x.1503= 400+30 = 430 enough for 1 more attrition

Bottom line AO helps, it does provide FP but you need a big attack bonus and a high level AO for a significant difference. Since doing this calculation for the guild I’ve increased my AB to 853 and AO to Level 100(.3028)
TAB=853(1+.5x.3038)= 983 (130 additional from AO)
 

67Sage101

Active Member
I'm in the IA, and recently added 30 to 40% to A/D with no discernable affects in fighting ability. This game keeps people pinned down for years. Keep collecting those A/D boosters, go ahead and build the AO and Kracken and in year or three you'll be fighting with the big dogs.
 

matr

New Member
I'm in the IA, and recently added 30 to 40% to A/D with no discernable affects in fighting ability. This game keeps people pinned down for years. Keep collecting those A/D boosters, go ahead and build the AO and Kracken and in year or three you'll be fighting with the big dogs.
The fighting boost stacks, meaning 30% adds to whatever percent you had. If you had 300% to start an additional 30% is a 10% boost - not much but should be noticeable. I have around 850% attack boost and when I add a 20% boost from stock plus the 30% boost from the tavern it makes enough of a difference that I don't have to be as careful in gbg. I can let troops run down to about 50% strength before replacing them using auto-battle. If I don't use the boosts It is trickier and I usually only attack again with all troop having less than 1 damage point. Keep in mind that just because your troops are 10 or 20% stronger it may not allow them to take an extra hit. They die when all their life points are used, if each enemy hit takes 70% of their points, meaning they die in 2 hits with a 40% margin, adding 20% still leaves them short. Same thing on attack, if your troops take 3 hits to kill the enemy instead of two, adding 10% may not reduce the kill hits to two and you are somewhat in the same position.
There are many factors to fighting, manual battle vs auto-battle is a big one. The AI for auto-battle is far worse than manually battling. I can do 12 to 15 additional attrition points using manual battle over where I stop with auto.
Other factors are troop selection, using terrain, paying attention to battle order, using rogues and knowing what the enemy AI typically does. There are many times I can trick the AI into attacking a fully healed unit instead on the one that is on the edge of death and win the battle with no loses.
The fun part is learning and improving. When I first started and entered the iron age, I got killed a bunch. my troops were weak and I didn't know how to use them very well. Actually, I didn't know to use them at all in the beginning. There are many good videos you can find if you search for Forge of Empires Battle Strategy. Just watching how others used their troops improved my fighting overnight. I still get frustrated when I'm not winning like I wish I was but that is what keeps the game interesting. If I won all the time and never lost it wouldn't be a challenge. Good luck to you and enjoy.