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Feedback for Guild Expedition.. Level 5

DreadfulCadillac

Well-Known Member
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#4 Guild on Jaims (US-9) - GE5 isn't being opened, because folks (rightfully) realize just how moronic it is. Just in case anybody from FOE actually reads these feedback threads, I've attached some screenshots that I believe to be pertinent to the matter.

Y'all played yourself with this, watch as this feature gets less usage than the PvP tower among active players/guilds, just saying.
 

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DreadfulCadillac

Well-Known Member
View attachment 20170View attachment 20171View attachment 20172View attachment 20173View attachment 20174View attachment 20175

#4 Guild on Jaims (US-9) - GE5 isn't being opened, because folks (rightfully) realize just how moronic it is. Just in case anybody from FOE actually reads these feedback threads, I've attached some screenshots that I believe to be pertinent to the matter.

Y'all played yourself with this, watch as this feature gets less usage than the PvP tower among active players/guilds, just saying.
Now, let's look at what some folks from other guilds are saying:
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P.S. Please for the love of god do NOT use the idea from the guy talking about "fragments of fragments" :joy:

Oh and yeah, *HAVE* yall heard of blockbuster? Don't end up a failure like them please
 

Pericles the Lion

Well-Known Member
View attachment 20170View attachment 20171View attachment 20172View attachment 20173View attachment 20174View attachment 20175

#4 Guild on Jaims (US-9) - GE5 isn't being opened, because folks (rightfully) realize just how moronic it is. Just in case anybody from FOE actually reads these feedback threads, I've attached some screenshots that I believe to be pertinent to the matter.

Y'all played yourself with this, watch as this feature gets less usage than the PvP tower among active players/guilds, just saying.
Unless your Guild has unanimous support for not opening level 5 - and I doubt that it does - it will start to lose members.
 

Eadyth

Active Member
Because of Space Carrier I needs to do 9 negotiations after each collection. Normally this is done mostly in the GE where the goods cost is cheaper (depending on attrition in GBG) and there is no time pressure (from GBG sectors closing quickly or speedy guildmates fighting the sector and getting all the fights), and I can use an extra turn for GE, not for GBG. Doing negotiation in GBG is not reasonable for every GBG session, depends on what parts of the map the player has access too.

In L5 I want to do as few negotiations as possible for obvious reasons. At the point I have to negotiate the end of L5, I need a tavern "extra turn" to do so. But if I have a 72 hour tavern defense boost going, I cannot also have an extra turn going without spending diamonds. So, I have to start that tavern boost early enough that it expires before the end of GE or I cannot negotiate the end.

It goes something like this:

Monday (after GE & GBG end)
collect SC, can't negotiate anywhere

Tuesday GE
negotiate 9/80 in GE
collect SC
negotiate 18/80 in GE

Wednesday GE
collect SC
negotiate 27/80 in GE (maybe skip because GBG starts the next day)

Thursday GE. GBG starts
negotiate first part of GBG to preserve attrition
collect SC
negotiate, preferably in GE 36/80 (so I need a tavern extra turn )
Also need to start a 72 hour defense boost in tavern early enough in the day such that 72 hours expires in time for me to do a tavern boost to help finish L5)

Friday GBG
collect SC
(72 hr tavern defense boost is still running)
I now have to either:
1) negotiate in GBG (must be done early in the day to not be very expensive and must be lucky to even have an opportunity to negotiate instead of fight),
or
2) negotiate in GE without a boost (very expensive, nope)
or
3) spend diamonds so I can have 2 tavern boosts at the same time (nope)
GE fighting because no extra turn

Saturday GBG
repeat Friday

Sunday GBG
Fight as far as I can in GE L5
Tavern boost expires sometime during the day giving me the opportunity to pay for an extra turn
collect SC, pay for extra turn
finish GE L5, probably doing about 4-8 negotiations (decreasing number each week as I up defense boost from city)
Am left with 1 to 5 negotiations I still need to do.

Monday GBG (GE ends)
Remember to finish negotiating before fighting in GBG or finish GE negotiations before GE ends 8 am game time)
or finish it in GBG in the morning if there is opportunity on the map
collect SC

Tuesday GBG/GE
negotiate GE 9/80
collect SC
Negotiating in GE 18/80

Wednesday GBG/GE
collect SC
negotiate GE 27/80 in GE

Thursday GBG/GE
collect SC
negotiate 27/80 in GE
Start 72 hour fight boost in tavern

Friday GBG/GE
collect SC
(72 hr tavern defense boost is still running)
I now have to either:
1) negotiate in GBG (must be done early in the day to not be very expensive and must be lucky to even have an opportunity to negotiate instead of fight),
or
2) negotiate in GE without a boost (very expensive)
or
3) spend diamonds so I can have 2 tavern boosts at the same time
GE fighting because no extra turn

Saturday GBG/GE
repeat Friday

Sunday GBG/GE
Fight as far as I can in GE L5
Tavern boost expires sometime during the day giving me the opportunity to pay for an extra turn
collect, pay for extra turn
finish GE L5, probably doing about 4-8 negotiations (decreasing number each week as I up defense boost from city)
Am left with 1 to 5 negotiations I still need to do.

Monday before GE & GBG end
Remember to finish negotiating in GE or GBG

Yuck.

I hate Fridays & Saturdays now. I wish I hadn't built my SC. This is a pain.

Edit: I forgot to mention that even before GE L5, I had to juggle my tavern attack boost and extra turn. That was already annoying, but reasonably doable.
 
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Eadyth

Active Member
We miss the Diamonds L1-L4 and then have to spend some to complete L5
Nope. Not going to do it (spend diamonds on L5). Not worth it. Inno has this balance to run. They need income (reasonable), but if they drive us away by being too greedy (greedy), then they don't get any. Zippo. Zero. I understand that they are business and need income but there comes a point where the game starts to be more work than fun and I'm not spending diamonds to fix that when they just reduced the availability of diamonds. Hard would have been okay with L5. But the double whammy of L5 hard and taking my diamonds (L1-L4), nope. You know what, its okay if I can't get all the way through L5 every week. And when this stops being fun, then people leave. This is a bad time for them to do this because RL reawakes whether COVID has gone away or not and strong players have been leaving. Inno has overstepped their greed. This is not good for them.
 
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P C C

Active Member
In the first week of GE 5 in my guild of 11 members who almost always all complete GE4, we had 6 players finish level 5, 2 players do most of the level, 2 barely start it, and 1 decide to ignore it. But based on internal feedback so far, I'd guess maybe 2 or 3 are enthusiastic with a few others dubious but willing to wait and see how it goes longer term.

I just reached SAJM about a month ago. At the time, I figured I'd left more buildings to provide SAV goods than I would ever need but now I'll have to see whether I can do anything effective or whether I'll need to wait for Titan
 

KimVM

New Member
Since I have an Abort 2000 RQ machine, paying the goods cost on a sustainable basis is not a problem for me. I have yet to see someone in my world have one and imagine these are quite scarce.

What makes up the machine: HC + SMB + CF + Unbirthday RQ. Level up the GB's to the level needed for doing 2000 Aborts every day and you will have all the goods you need. This is relatively easy in lower eras but it appears to top out in Future era. Hyperleveling the CF to at least 158 for a 50 Goods reward looks to be the goal based on what I saw in Cirgard, where a SAJM player was able to sell SAJM goods when the AI came out at the rate of two sets a day. Add in the SMB at Level 100 and the HC at 91 from his city. If you want more recursion ability, increase the HC and CF some more.
That won't help in upper eras where there is no longer a UBQ quest. The city defense needed to get through GE5 in the space ages rivals what we've all worked for in attack a/d. There's no room for that. Either we spend a TON of goods or scrap it. They need to balance it out. It's easy to get through level 5 of GE with hovers in low eras, next to impossible for anyone in the space ages that has focused on attacking, instead of city defense. This is the way inno pushed us all to go (build attack and ignore city defense) when they made the space ages troops capable of blowing right through any and all city defense as if it did not exist.

Instead of trying to change the dynamics of the game to get folks to place and level up gb's they made worthless until now, inno should be trying to find improvements to those gb's.
 

KimVM

New Member
Why people are complaining? It's been ages since defense for defending army was used by players. Now is the time. Just take your time and slowly increase your def stats. Not a big deal.
Fragments are another story. Doesn't look good but in general rewards for GE1-4 are better than it was. No crappy victory towers, medals etc.
Change is good, if it's something worth working for. When they have repeatedly made city defense worthless (for FOUR space ages, now - since Mars came out, it's cake to bust through ANY city defense army of ANY strength), why would they suddenly put out a product (GE5) that is impossible to succeed on without city defense of well over 1000? It's just a crappy thing to do to the players that have worked so hard on their attack and neglected city defense that inno made useless. I think a challenge is good (hell, I have heard that Titan is just going to be like all the other space ages, and that's boring), but changing the entire dynamic of GE for level 5 so that I can barely fight through 1 encounter (and that's only if I dope up on a ton of defense potions) is just crappy. Add to that the prizes that are so worthless, it just makes me wonder why I bother to play this game. The bulk of the prizes are fragments of things we already didn't want (for levels 1-3). I do like the extra troops in level 4 and I get the extra fp payouts can be nice, unless you're in JM and your city is pretty well developed.
 

Pericles the Lion

Well-Known Member
Players keep complaining about "INNO made defense worthless" and "INNO forced us to {fill in the blank}. INNO didn't force us to do anything. Every day I go into the PvP arena and see lots of players with what I consider to be very high defense stats (>500). About a month ago I would be grinning and thinking "what a waste of space". Now, I suppose, those players are getting the last laugh. We chose to ignore city defense because the rewards were sparse. Times appear to be changing. The rewards from GE5 may not be enough to persuade players to abandon some of their attack army boosts, which is fine. In coming months, I would not be surprised if INNO introduced more features that depend on city defense. If this happens, then the cost:benefit relationship might swing more in favor of city defense. One thing is for sure. At least for me the game has become a lot more interesting.
 

honey55

Active Member
Feedback would mean more if everyone's experience was the same. The fact that some ages can fight without redoing their entire city because they're in lower age while if one is in a space age or has to negotiate makes feedback age dependent. Iwouldnt be surprised if all players in industrial age or future for example love L5. But i would like to know how many in Jupiter, that hate to negotiate, love it. I asked my guild how much city defense is needed to win the first battle in level 5without using boosts and the few responses were they couldnt find a way to win even one fight by fighting. They had to negotiate. I play for fun. I actuslly hate negotiating even the first fights in level 1 where i know I'll win. The more choices, the more i hate it. So negotiating isn't going to happen. If this was the same experience for all age players, at least the feedback would be meaningful. But for some to brag how easy it is because they have a different experience than me, because they didn't move up in age is not helpful. I can't move back to a lower age. This is just one more area where the game rewards one for not progressing to the highest age. I've been told by some that they could go to 150 to even 300 attrition because of using advanced troops by hanging out at a low age. I guess that is smart play, not moving up. Maybe someone here can answer the question. How high boosts are needed to win the first fight in level 5 in jupiter without using stackable boosts, since that's not sustainable? How many for the 8th? How many for the last? Pretty sure long term in my age means years, where in lower ages means months but I'll be more than happy to be proved wrong. What do i need and what's the best way to get it.
 

Pericles the Lion

Well-Known Member
Feedback would mean more if everyone's experience was the same. The fact that some ages can fight without redoing their entire city because they're in lower age while if one is in a space age or has to negotiate makes feedback age dependent. Iwouldnt be surprised if all players in industrial age or future for example love L5. But i would like to know how many in Jupiter, that hate to negotiate, love it. I asked my guild how much city defense is needed to win the first battle in level 5without using boosts and the few responses were they couldnt find a way to win even one fight by fighting. They had to negotiate. I play for fun. I actuslly hate negotiating even the first fights in level 1 where i know I'll win. The more choices, the more i hate it. So negotiating isn't going to happen. If this was the same experience for all age players, at least the feedback would be meaningful. But for some to brag how easy it is because they have a different experience than me, because they didn't move up in age is not helpful. I can't move back to a lower age. This is just one more area where the game rewards one for not progressing to the highest age. I've been told by some that they could go to 150 to even 300 attrition because of using advanced troops by hanging out at a low age. I guess that is smart play, not moving up. Maybe someone here can answer the question. How high boosts are needed to win the first fight in level 5 in jupiter without using stackable boosts, since that's not sustainable? How many for the 8th? How many for the last? Pretty sure long term in my age means years, where in lower ages means months but I'll be more than happy to be proved wrong. What do i need and what's the best way to get it.
I'm in SAJM. Last season my Defense boosts were both <150 and I couldn't beat the first wave of the first encounter. This season, with boosts of 191/347 (no potions or tavern) I was able to win the first wave but not the second. Like you, I'm trying to determine what is necessary to win the first 7-8 battles. Hopefully, others will be able to help fill in the missing pieces.
 

Dursland

Well-Known Member
What do i need and what's the best way to get it.
Personally I'm going after those new red/blue stat boosting buildings they are releasing. I call them two-way buildings. Like the Phantom Tower, Keymaster's Workshop, and the upcoming Panda Shrine.

Looks like inno has adjusted buildings to reflect the new reality of the game and we just need to keep stacking up on them then GE5 will be beatable.
 

-Aang-

New Member
I too pay in a lot to play the game, but I am questioning this strategy now. The changes to GE have people in my guild talking about deleting their ToR, playing less, leaving the game, and we have decided not to even open GE5 after the first week due to the cost in goods. It is just not worth it for anyone. Inno, you are going to lose players, players that give you $$.
 

-Aang-

New Member
If they feel strongly that it's a waste of guild resources. Not saying that many would feel that way, but it's possible.
We put it to a vote to our guild members. We let them know the cost of opening GE5, and all who responded voted to not open it. Due to the lessened rewards from the nerfed ToR, myself and others are discussing pulling it. GE is dead... we are keeping GE4 open just so people can get their negs in, and the ranking points.
 
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