Chateau Frontenac for younger cities worth it?

[Eleanor The Krusty]

I’ve come to the conclusion that the more advanced players in every guild have no memory of what it’s like to be a younger city, and are all obsessed with certain GBs, giving the same tired advice - “Get an Arc, get a Traz. Build your Arc to level 80.” Thanks, Kevin, but how does that advice help me, someone who’s just come out of Iron Age and who gets 20 FP a day? For this reason I am unable to trust their advice to build CF next. After looking it up and seeing that CF, while an awesome building, really only makes sense if you’re getting recurring quests and have exhausted all daily and story quests. Is this something that most young cities can even take advantage of when many of us can’t even complete many of the story or daily quests with our limited resources and lack of fighting power? I think people who have been playing for literally years have lost all perspective on what it’s like to just start out and need to concentrate on goods and military power instead. Please correct me if I’m wrong. It’s why I’m asking here instead of on my guilds. Thank you

 

[DeletedUser37581]

I think it depends on what you want to accomplish. When I started my beta city, I built up only an Arc and a CF. However, that city is going to stay in Iron Age for a while. I now generate all the goods I want and have plenty of FPs in inventory.

I am currently experimenting with a new city. The first GB I will build will be a CF. I will be keeping that city in Iron Age for a while also.

In my opinion, a level 5+ CF eliminates the need for goods buildings, so it is worth it even at relatively low levels.

 

[Graviton]

If you're not willing to do recurring quests, building a Chateau makes no sense.

I'll disagree with this, I think the Chateau is valuable no matter how high you level it. Increasing the haul from quests is an even more valuable power when you're a lower-era city. The Himeji Castle is great as well, extremely valuable, but part of the OP's point is that it's difficult and time-consuming to build high-era GBs when you're just starting out. The Chateau is much easier to get.

 

[Eleanor The Krusty]

I think it depends on what you want to accomplish. When I started my beta city, I built up only an Arc and a CF. However, that city is going to stay in Iron Age for a while. I now generate all the goods I want and have plenty of FPs in inventory.

I am currently experimenting with a new city. The first GB I will build will be a CF. I will be keeping that city in Iron Age for a while also.

In my opinion, a level 5+ CF eliminates the need for goods buildings, so it is worth it even at relatively low levels.

I’m not talking about someone who has planted themselves in a lower age for a while and stayed there while building up a level 80 Arc and all of the GBs. I’m talking about a truly younger city, like someone who has just started their city a few weeks earlier

 

[Eleanor The Krusty]

I'll disagree with this, I think the Chateau is valuable no matter how high you level it. Increasing the haul from quests is an even more valuable power when you're a lower-era city. The Himeji Castle is great as well, extremely valuable, but part of the OP's point is that it's difficult and time-consuming to build high-era GBs when you're just starting out. The Chateau is much easier to get.

No, you all seem to be confused as to what I’m even saying. I’m talking about how it’s not actually useful if you’re not getting recurring quests and are still getting story quests and daily quests

And I’m asking a question

 

[Eleanor The Krusty]

CF totally useless if you’re not getting recurring quests and still only getting daily and story quests. Just like Arc not that useful if you don’t have a lot of FP coming in, and Traz not super useful if you don’t have many military buildings or much military power to do anything with it. Sometimes what younger cities JUST STARTING OUT truly need are goods buildings and buildings that give population

But I’m asking a question - when do recurring quests start? Because I’ve been playing for several months and still get daily quests and storyline quests. So I don’t think a CF would help me. Am I wrong and recurring quests are there and I’m missing them?

 

[DevaCat]

Hello Eleanor, I get where you're coming from regarding advice that sometimes comes from long time players. I think some of that is simply due to lazy thinking rather than not remembering what it was like to be starting a city with limited resources. You mention just coming out of Iron Age, making 20 fps a day, and being advised to build the CF next. Without knowing what you already have placed, I'll take a risk and say that advice is poor. Your focus should really be on coming out of Iron Age only bringing in 20 fps a day. An Iron Age city could easily bring in triple that.

Take RazorbackPirate's advice and study the HQS condensed guide. I studied that one as well as the entire Cosmic Raven original (okay, I'm a masochist lol) and ideas I took from them is helping me build stronger cities. One is that there are 5 or 6 key GBs every city should have. The order in which they are built is of importance, and once built their effects will feed off each other. Those guides gave me a roadmap to work with.

The Chateau is on that list and one I will have in any of my four cities still lacking one. I agree that it's valuable early on; as said, the CF allows you to eliminate goods buildings and associated housing, freeing up space for FP producing buildings. As a byproduct that also makes you largely plunder-proof.

Alcatraz is another to consider should you want to go a fighting route. It's huge, true, but allows you to eliminate military buildings and their housing, and provides Happiness letting you ditch all the culture and decos and use all that space for FP generation. It would be one to put up after the others I'd think.

Just saw your recent posts. Answer is, you are trying to do all the side quests. Don't, they are largely not worth it. Abort them and you will get to the RQs.

 

[Eleanor The Krusty]

Hello Eleanor, I get where you're coming from regarding advice that sometimes comes from long time players. I think some of that is simply due to lazy thinking rather than not remembering what it was like to be starting a city with limited resources. You mention just coming out of Iron Age, making 20 fps a day, and being advised to build the CF next. Without knowing what you already have placed, I'll take a risk and say that advice is poor. Your focus should really be on coming out of Iron Age only bringing in 20 fps a day. An Iron Age city could easily bring in triple that.

Take RazorbackPirate's advice and study the HQS condensed guide. I studied that one as well as the entire Cosmic Raven original (okay, I'm a masochist lol) and ideas I took from them is helping me build stronger cities. One is that there are 5 or 6 key GBs every city should have. The order in which they are built is of importance, and once built their effects will feed off each other. Those guides gave me a roadmap to work with.

The Chateau is on that list and one I will have in any of my four cities still lacking one. I agree that it's valuable early on; as said, the CF allows you to eliminate goods buildings and associated housing, freeing up space for FP producing buildings. As a byproduct that also makes you largely plunder-proof.

Alcatraz is another to consider should you want to go a fighting route. It's huge, true, but allows you to eliminate military buildings and their housing, and provides Happiness letting you ditch all the culture and decos and use all that space for FP generation. It would be one to put up after the others I'd think.

Just saw your recent posts. Answer is, you are trying to do all the side quests. Don't, they are largely not worth it. Abort them and you will get to the RQs.

How can you eliminate ALL military buildings and utilize the Alcatraz? Doesn’t Alcatraz generate military units based on the military units your military buildings in your city generate? See this is the kind of bad advice I’m talking about. Terrible advice to give to someone who really really should just get a Zeus first, build that up to level 7, then a COA, then a CDM

 

[UBERhelp1]

How can you eliminate ALL military buildings and utilize the Alcatraz? Doesn’t Alcatraz generate military units based on the military units your military buildings in your city generate? See this is the kind of bad advice I’m talking about. Terrible advice to give to someone who really really should just get a Zeus first, build that up to level 7, then a COA, then a CDM

He didn't say all military. You really only need one or two military buildings depending on your needs though.

Also why level 7? Why not 10?

 

[Eleanor The Krusty]

Just saw your recent posts. Answer is, you are trying to do all the side quests. Don't, they are largely not worth it. Abort them and you will get to the RQs.

Speaking of lazy thinking - you really cannot abort all side quests. You know that, right? It doesn’t allow you to. that option doesn’t exist for all side quests and you end up having to do a large portion of them. Can someone who actually remembers what it’s like to be a younger city try answering for once?

 

[UBERhelp1]

Speaking of lazy thinking - you really cannot abort all side quests. You know that, right? It doesn’t allow you to. that option doesn’t exist for all side quests and you end up having to do a large portion of them. Can someone who actually remembers what it’s like to be a younger city try answering for once?

All side quests are abortable. Only story quests are non-abortable.

 

[DevaCat]

Lol, and please excuse me for being a lazy thinker too! I'm not that advanced or an old timer (LMA, 654 days oldest city), but I'd also forgotten how much I didn't know when I was only a few months in.

You, however, seem to know quite a lot for someone who actually knows little. Odd attitude for someone seeking help. Or is it you just want to vent?

Check the attitude, let us know what world your city is in, what GBs you have, the basics, and someone will surely help. Keep the attitude and you are just a waste of time. Good luck to you.

 

[Eleanor The Krusty]

Lol, and please excuse me for being a lazy thinker too! I'm not that advanced or an old timer (LMA, 654 days oldest city), but I'd also forgotten how much I didn't know when I was only a few months in.

You, however, seem to know quite a lot for someone who actually knows little. Odd attitude for someone seeking help. Or is it you just want to vent?

Check the attitude, let us know what world your city is in, what GBs you have, the basics, and someone will surely help. Keep the attitude and you are just a waste of time. Good luck to you.

See, this is EXACTLY the kind of BS I’m talking about, the “I’ve been playing for several years so I know everything and even though I forgot what it’s like to be in your shoes and run out of goods, FP and resources , I’m gonna give you terrible advice that will not help you at all” attitude that advanced players constantly give. Let me reiterate over and over again - I am NOT talking about players who have been playing for years who have decided to plant their @sses in Iron Age, for those who cannot read. I am talking about people who literally just started their cities a few weeks earlier. Can people please stop giving advice as if I’m talking about the well known strategy of staying in a lower age and building up your GBs? Please actually read the actual question. And yes, in this particular instance I do know more about what it’s like to be an actual younger city dealing with advanced players giving the same old tired advice, and I’m trying to find out when recurring quests actually begin and getting really ignorant responses like “abort all story quests”, when if you were a player who had only started your city a few weeks or months before you’d know that that I so not actually possible. Heck, even someone who has been playing for years should know that’s not at all possible. So enough with the “I have been playing for X number of years, so I can answer from your perspective.”, as this isn’t EXACTLY the problem one runs into on guilds in this game over and over and over again. Thank you for once again showing how cliche advanced players are

Now if someone’s could actually READ the actual question as written, and not through their advanced player “I’ve been playing for X number of years, so I’ll assume I can relate” perspective, that would be SUPER EFFING DUPER

 

[Dominator - X]

He didn't say all military. You really only need one or two military buildings depending on your needs though.

Also why level 7? Why not 10?

You really don't need any military buildings with the Traz, unless you want a specific troop. With no military buildings, you will get a random troop from your age. (On 2nd thought, my troops came from my Dojos)

When I first placed my Traz, I had about 3 buildings of a troop I wanted to build up and used the attached troops as far as I could, so I could build up the unattached troops. Then I would switch to another building and do the same thing until I had a slew of unattached troops to work with.

However, as I mentioned above, you can get away with no military buildings, if a person wants the space for something else and still get troops from the Traz. (sorry, nope. Need at least 1 military building to produce troops from the Traz)

 

[Graviton]

No, you all seem to be confused as to what I’m even saying. I’m talking about how it’s not actually useful if you’re not getting recurring quests and are still getting story quests and daily quests

The CF increase those rewards as well, but it sounds like you've already decided the answer. I agree with @DevaCat, you need to dial back the attitude when you're asking for advice, even if you're frustrated with the answers you're getting.

You really don't need any military buildings with the Traz, unless you want a specific troop. With no military buildings, you will get a random troop from your age.

That's not how the Traz works. It'll give you troops from whatever barracks you actually have. If you have no military buildings it will give you nothing.

"Alcatraz is a great building that increases happiness and produces the unattached versions of the military units that the military buildings constructed in the city do... Alcatraz provides units from all military buildings in your city - it does not matter if the military building is not connected by a road or is still under construction. However if you do not have any military buildings in your city, Alcatraz will NOT produce any units. "

 

[Algona]

CF totally useless if you’re not getting recurring quests and still only getting daily and story quests.

Well, no. CF gives bonuses to all applicable Rewards, including Story, Side, and Bonus Quests.

If you choose not to farm RQs, CF can still be of value especially if you are a freeroller, there are a useful number f Quests that pay Diamonds that get boosted by CF. This will help with Diamond Expansions.

If I were starting a new city and was not going to farm RQs, I would not not build a CF until I had assures that I could do DCs, 64 GE, and go deep in GBG.

Which is exactly the approach I took in my most recent city.

My bona fides? I started five years ago. I started a new city three years ago, again last year. Both of those were documented in Glarg's Guide on starting a new city. And, yeah, I am an expert on how to start new cities.

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Completely unsolicited advice, do with it what you will. Being in EMA and only producing 20 additional FP per day is a sign that you may be moving through the tech tree too fast,

You might consider slowing down your tech climb a bit. This game requires players to either take a fair amount of time in each Era building up capability or reach a point where the city is woefully unprepared for facing the ever increasing difficulty of GE, GBG, DCs, Quests, Events, Tech and CMap progress.

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More unsolicited advice. You need to stop this:

you really cannot abort all side quests. You know that, right?

You don't know how to say you are wrong. Worse, you can't seem to recognize the fact that when multiple long term players tell you something fundamental about the game that disagree with what you think you; are the one who is almost certainly wrong.

I first noticed this about you in the thread in bugs where you were completely wrong, a n00b arguing with folk who are expert (the first respondent wrote the best Guide on this forum), and carried it over into the silly argument about flipping GBs.

You need to be a lot more graceful. This game is a social game, if you treat Guildies the way you treat folk on this forum you'll have a tough time staying in any Guild worth being in.

Your first post in this thread was almost entirely a statement indicting lng term players for not understanding starting a new city, then you asked for help.

So enough with the “I have been playing for X number of years, so I can answer from your perspective.”, as thjs isn’t EXACTLY the problem

Just who do you think can answer this sort of questions? The folk who have played for years? Or other new players?

More grace, less attitude.

 

[Dominator - X]

How can you eliminate ALL military buildings and utilize the Alcatraz? Doesn’t Alcatraz generate military units based on the military units your military buildings in your city generate? See this is the kind of bad advice I’m talking about. Terrible advice to give to someone who really really should just get a Zeus first, build that up to level 7, then a COA, then a CDM

No offense, but I don't think Devacat's advice was bad. But, that is why we come here, right? To learn from others experience and opinions. Regardless, even if you only have 1 military building, you still save a ton of room to produce other things, so the Traz does free up some space if you are into fighting.

 

[Dominator - X]

The CF increase those rewards as well, but it sounds like you've already decided the answer. I agree with @DevaCat, you need to dial back the attitude when you're asking for advice, even if you're frustrated with the answers you're getting.



That's not how the Traz works. It'll give you troops from whatever barracks you actually have. If you have no military buildings it will give you nothing. From the wiki:

"Alcatraz is a great building that increases happiness and produces the unattached versions of the military units that the military buildings constructed in the city do."

There must be a bug with mine, then. When I had no military buildings, I did receive some random troops from my age. On 2nd thought, my troops came from my Dojos, so the bug must have been sick those days.

 

[Graviton]

I think you got troops from a quest or from the continent map, you didn't get any from your Traz.

 

[Algona]

There must be a bug with mine, then. When I had no military buildings, I did receive some random troops from my age.

Any chance you have either a lvl 5 Dojo or Emissaries that grant troops?

Traz will not give troops if you have no barracks of any sort.