DeletedUser
Well, I guess if you strongly disagree, then I must be wrong. Why didn't you say so in the first place? Would have saved us a lot of time.
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DeletedUser30900
So I guess he's saying "I can't find any reason to prove you are wrong but I just have to be right"
DeletedUser26120
Got 2 gold relics today and both were tribal squares. Laid them down.
Now producing 77 of each CE goods per week, along with 112 of each PME goods.
1,268,000 coins daily from the squares, and plan to put 4 levels on my st mark's soon so that'll go up a bit.
Now producing 77 of each CE goods per week, along with 112 of each PME goods.
1,268,000 coins daily from the squares, and plan to put 4 levels on my st mark's soon so that'll go up a bit.
DeletedUser13838
I did. But when your argument is based on bugged 4 hour OF housing and how houses can take motivations from SoKs, it just shows me you're being completely disingenuous.
DeletedUser29055
Did anyone actually do the math to see whether they are worth in which ages? Because I did the math for HMA in my world and doing housing, good buildings, and happiness gives me .7 goods per squares, whereas a tribal square gives me .4 per square (I choose residential with highest population per square, motivated face of ancient, and biggest good building). For PE in my other world, it starts to get more interesting as due to the 2 lane requirement and huger good buildings footprint, the tribal square gives me the same amount of good per square. But, and I have to say but here, in my PE world I do not need face of ancient or much housing anymore, since I have Inno and Alcatraz, both can be upgraded to provide more population and happiness. So, if I remove the face of ancient, then my good building give me a bit more good by square. Not much, but still a bit more.
I use tribal squares only as fillers and delete them when needed. I still think good buildings give more goods based on my math, but maybe I did my math wrong or did not consider something else. Trading goods does not bother me yet since I have enough good trading partners. And I do not get that much plundered. I did not look at gold output for PE, but for my HMA city tribal and houses are comparable.
Edit: I did forget that tribal squares give population and need happiness building. So for my HMA they are even worse.
I use tribal squares only as fillers and delete them when needed. I still think good buildings give more goods based on my math, but maybe I did my math wrong or did not consider something else. Trading goods does not bother me yet since I have enough good trading partners. And I do not get that much plundered. I did not look at gold output for PE, but for my HMA city tribal and houses are comparable.
Edit: I did forget that tribal squares give population and need happiness building. So for my HMA they are even worse.
DeletedUser
You also forgot to factor in the coin/supply cost/space requirements for the goods buildings. And you forgot the most important factor, which is that with the Tribal Square you get an even distribution of all 5 goods from that age, not just one that you then have to trade to get the others.
DeletedUser29055
Hmm, I deleted my calculations, but coin and supply is a good one to include. I doubt it would make a difference for HMA, though. And trading, I do not count. It may be inconvenience, but at 1:1 trade within age, no loss of goods.
DeletedUser
Since the most efficient production building in HMA is the Farm, that would definitely affect the calculation, especially when you include the 2 extra houses you would need to provide population for each one of them. That's 28 more tiles.
Trading is fine if you happen to be in a guild that has plenty of all 5 goods from each era. If not, you have to try and find them from friends/neighbors. Sometimes there are goods that are rarer than others for whatever reason. And even if you find them, you then have to pay FP to take the trades. In my experience (over 2 years of playing, on all 23 worlds at some point, in dozens of guilds) finding a guild that can fill any trade needs that you have is rather rare. So a little more than an inconvenience for most players.
It's really easy to just discount points that don't mesh with your view on a subject, but it's not honest and it doesn't add to the discussion.
DeletedUser29055
hmm
Hmm, I changed my mind. Not because of your irrelevant post that did not add anything (equal distribution, haha). But I did the math and I did not consider a vital point.
With the population that I get from the tribal squares, I can have an additional goods building. And even if you need the Alchemist to provide the additional goods building .. that what makes the difference.
Want to see my calculations?
4 tribal squares are needed to get 20 goods. They give me a lot of coins and enough population for another goods building. I do need one additional Alchemist and one Face of Ancient. 40 goods /( 4*12 + 9 + 4)= .66 goods per square
No, just getting 20 goods requires:
1 goods building 12 squares
1 Alchemist 9 squares
4 Townhomes 16 squares
2 Face of Ancients 8 squares
= 20 / 45 = .44 goods per square
If I have time, I may do this for my PE city - with my boosts and GB and all. Curious to see what the result is there. I am still not convinced that tribal squares are always better, but until I see calculations, I don't believe anything.
Hmm, I changed my mind. Not because of your irrelevant post that did not add anything (equal distribution, haha). But I did the math and I did not consider a vital point.
With the population that I get from the tribal squares, I can have an additional goods building. And even if you need the Alchemist to provide the additional goods building .. that what makes the difference.
Want to see my calculations?
4 tribal squares are needed to get 20 goods. They give me a lot of coins and enough population for another goods building. I do need one additional Alchemist and one Face of Ancient. 40 goods /( 4*12 + 9 + 4)= .66 goods per square
No, just getting 20 goods requires:
1 goods building 12 squares
1 Alchemist 9 squares
4 Townhomes 16 squares
2 Face of Ancients 8 squares
= 20 / 45 = .44 goods per square
If I have time, I may do this for my PE city - with my boosts and GB and all. Curious to see what the result is there. I am still not convinced that tribal squares are always better, but until I see calculations, I don't believe anything.
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DeletedUser
In my CE city, I have had no goods buildings at all for months. I only had 3 at the most, and then only for a week or so. But I have lots of Tribal Squares, and my goods inventory stands at over 1200 of each of the 5 goods. No trading required. No coins or supplies needed. No houses necessary to support the buildings. And since I don't have any houses or cultural buildings, and only 2 production buildings, there are plenty of motivations to get all my Tribal Squares. Every day. I don't need to see calculations when I can see results.
DeletedUser29055
Hmm, but, without calculations you do not know which one is better. Maybe you could get more goods with normal good buildings.
Okay, I did the calculations for my PE city. Please, I want to encourage discussion and if my calculations and thoughts are incorrect or missing, I do welcome critic. But it needs to be critic based in facts, not beliefs.
Okay, PE city. I have an Inno and Alcatraz and I will not include them in my calculations, because I would have them anyway. So, what I did was simply looking what houses and good buildings I have. I would not delete my two supply buildings anyway. So, I just thought - if I remove my houses and good buildings, how many tribal squares could I fit.
Okay, I have 10 good buildings (from both PE and IA age) that give me 200 goods per day and 5 high rises, that require 266 squares (I included 2 lane requirement). The high rises give me 181, 125 coins in a day.
22 Tribal Squares fit in 200 squares. 16 Tribal squares give me 110 goods a day and 550K coins.
Hmm ... unless I am wrong ... I can do 200 goods with good buildings and 110 goods with tribal squares.
Where am I wrong that you are so convinced that tribal squares are better?
Inventory stands are meaningless, what are you doing with you goods? Do you have GB that produce goods? Are you also plundering? The question is. How many goods are you making in a day - from your city. And can you make more with one method or the other.
I am seriously asking this. Because I can see the love for tribal squares. And I don't get it. Good, in my HMA city they would be better. However, I just got ToR and have so far 1 tribal square. So, it will take time to get enough tribal squares. For my PE city, I just don't think tribal squares are better.
Btw. once I have my Inno leveled higher, I don't my high rises anymore and can put in two more goods buildings. 240 goods a week versus 80 goods ... No gold income from high rises, but on the other hand the 400,544 coins from the tribal squares would not even do two recurring quests, so. 240 versus 110 goods ...
Okay, I did the calculations for my PE city. Please, I want to encourage discussion and if my calculations and thoughts are incorrect or missing, I do welcome critic. But it needs to be critic based in facts, not beliefs.
Okay, PE city. I have an Inno and Alcatraz and I will not include them in my calculations, because I would have them anyway. So, what I did was simply looking what houses and good buildings I have. I would not delete my two supply buildings anyway. So, I just thought - if I remove my houses and good buildings, how many tribal squares could I fit.
Okay, I have 10 good buildings (from both PE and IA age) that give me 200 goods per day and 5 high rises, that require 266 squares (I included 2 lane requirement). The high rises give me 181, 125 coins in a day.
22 Tribal Squares fit in 200 squares. 16 Tribal squares give me 110 goods a day and 550K coins.
Hmm ... unless I am wrong ... I can do 200 goods with good buildings and 110 goods with tribal squares.
Where am I wrong that you are so convinced that tribal squares are better?
Inventory stands are meaningless, what are you doing with you goods? Do you have GB that produce goods? Are you also plundering? The question is. How many goods are you making in a day - from your city. And can you make more with one method or the other.
I am seriously asking this. Because I can see the love for tribal squares. And I don't get it. Good, in my HMA city they would be better. However, I just got ToR and have so far 1 tribal square. So, it will take time to get enough tribal squares. For my PE city, I just don't think tribal squares are better.
Btw. once I have my Inno leveled higher, I don't my high rises anymore and can put in two more goods buildings. 240 goods a week versus 80 goods ... No gold income from high rises, but on the other hand the 400,544 coins from the tribal squares would not even do two recurring quests, so. 240 versus 110 goods ...
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DeletedUser
Well, I'm in CE, which you will find is a different animal than PE. I currently have 12 Tribal Squares producing 60 non-plunderable goods per day. They take up 144 tiles. Of the 3 CE goods that I am boosted in, the smallest building is 6x4, or 24 tiles. So I could fit 6 in the space that I have the Tribal Squares. Oh, but wait, they require 2 lane roads, so maybe only 4. So that's somewhere between 80-120 plunderable goods. There's more. With the Tribal Squares, I have 12 of each good per day. No fussing with finding trades to even out the inventory. If I want to get all 3 of the goods I've got boosts for, production would fall to about the same level as the Tribal Squares due to building size. And I still have to trade to get the other 2 goods. And they're susceptible to plundering. And the Tribal Squares help enable me to fufill 4 recurring coin quests per day, which has the potential for even more goods, which are enhanced by my Chateau Frontenac. So in my case it is hands down better to use the Tribal Squares instead of regular CE goods buildings. By the way, I didn't even get into the need for unrefined goods, which you haven't run into yet. That starts in Modern Era. So, if you don't have the goods GBs to produce the unrefined goods, guess what? You have to build lower era goods buildings (assuming you have the right boosts and don't have to trade for them) just to produce your current era goods.
DeletedUser29055
Here you go - now you can talk about your love for tribal squares with a basis . Thanks for the calculation. I would still do good buildings in your case, but it seems to be closer and thus your other factors such as non-trading, plunder may be more justified. I don't care about plunder or trade. Collect on time and find a better guild takes care of that.
And yes, I am prepared for unrefined goods as I have all good GB buildings. Not particularly looking forward to modern, but I am prepared ...
What this tells me is to look closely at my city and for my situation see which one is better. I get out of this discussion that tribal squares can indeed be preferable. Honestly, I am surprised that tribal squares can be better. Learned something.
Edit: I did find one error in my above calculation so it's 200 to 110 goods, but oh well. I don't have 22 tribal squares anyway. I do GE 4 level every week with a level 5 ToR each week, but 22 tribal squares would take some time.
. Thanks for the calculation. I would still do good buildings in your case, but it seems to be closer and thus your other factors such as non-trading, plunder may be more justified. I don't care about plunder or trade. Collect on time and find a better guild takes care of that.And yes, I am prepared for unrefined goods as I have all good GB buildings. Not particularly looking forward to modern, but I am prepared ...
What this tells me is to look closely at my city and for my situation see which one is better. I get out of this discussion that tribal squares can indeed be preferable. Honestly, I am surprised that tribal squares can be better. Learned something.
Edit: I did find one error in my above calculation so it's 200 to 110 goods, but oh well. I don't have 22 tribal squares anyway. I do GE 4 level every week with a level 5 ToR each week, but 22 tribal squares would take some time.
DeletedUser13838
By the way, a level 10 seed vault will average up to 50-60 current age goods (after PE) per day (depending how many aids you can get).
Level 10 seed vault has 2.9% chance to proc on any aid. If you have a full social bar (friends guild hood) you can aid up to 300 people per day. Suppose you aid 250 then you will proc on average. Each proc has about a 1 in 3 chance of goods through PE you get 2 of each and after PE you get 4 of each (seems backwards but that's the way it is). In CE that means 250*.029*0.33*20 = 48 CE goods. TO get that many goods from dynamic tower you'd need it at level 19 but the age of the goods will vary.
Level 10 seed vault has 2.9% chance to proc on any aid. If you have a full social bar (friends guild hood) you can aid up to 300 people per day. Suppose you aid 250 then you will proc on average. Each proc has about a 1 in 3 chance of goods through PE you get 2 of each and after PE you get 4 of each (seems backwards but that's the way it is). In CE that means 250*.029*0.33*20 = 48 CE goods. TO get that many goods from dynamic tower you'd need it at level 19 but the age of the goods will vary.
DeletedUser26120
Just removed some for the first time ever. 6 squares gone to make room for a terrace farm, elephant fountain+garden for coin bonus, and space for 3 SoKs that I hope to get in fall event.
RIP tribal squares but I have plenty of postmodern goods. Thank you for your service.
RIP tribal squares but I have plenty of postmodern goods. Thank you for your service.
DeletedUser26154
I've always liked these buildings.
Even though I don't use them.
I planted a few for a week to see how they felt.
Then put them back into storage.
The Tribal Square is what I call a Hybrid Building.
Helps with your population, gives a nice chunk of coins, and also goods.
People think 5 is not a lot, but they miss other factors.
You don't have to pay for those goods with population and happiness.
The building that makes goods [Tribal Square] gives you population instead of taking some away.
That little Differential makes a huge difference.
If you have 10 Arctic Future Tribal Squares, that's 50 goods a day.
Two Arctic Future goods buildings take about 10,000 population.
That's what I mean by Differential.
It's a different way of allocating population to production.
You get a bunch of those Tribal Squares.
Then their benefit really shines.
Unless you run a Heavy [Fill in the Blank] City.
DeletedUser38659
I don't know how relevant this thread is anymore but I just picked up a stray Tribal Square that I hadn't realized I missed at my last city cleansing. There's nothing wrong with them. It's just that I can buy goods of any era using FP when I get to the point that I can no longer open up Campaign map zones. The space in my city is primarily used for FP and military. SoK take care of my coin and Sleigh Builders take care of my goods. Thanks to the Auctioneer, I have a practical use for my Tribal Squares, not that they're impractical in the right cities.
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RazorbackPirate
Well-Known Member
Wow. Your SoKs make Gold? Mine just make Coins and FPs. Being in LMA, I don't have much use for Gold anymore, so I guess having Coins instead works out for the best.
OutlawDon
Member
My problem is that the Story Quest line is trying to push me out of Progressive into Modern when I'm not ready to move out of Progressive. I'm going to pause on the Story Quest in order to stay in Progressive (which cuts me off from future Story Quests.) This always happens when you get close to the end of an era. This is the thing I dislike most about FoE: that it tries to push you along the timeline too fast.
RazorbackPirate
Well-Known Member
While the Story quest line will always show you the next action, it's up to you when to do it. There's nothing pushing you to do it, other than you. They're not going anywhere. I've not touched the Story line in months and won't touch it until I'm ready to age up. Then, as is typical for me, I'll rushj through the tech tree and Story quests until I get to the end of the age, then sit again until I'm ready to move on again.