GvG Lag - "tile 38,75"

[DeletedUser]

Old codes, old programming, and old ways of making games have to be modernized so that errors no longer exist simply because a person logs into the game.

Given that they are constantly updating, upgrading and adding features to the game, I doubt that this is the problem. Especially since they have spent the last couple of years converting the entire game from Flash to HTML-5.

Have you all never seen what happens when they try to fix the problem of rush hour congestion on the roads? Nothing ever works. They can build new roads. They can widen old ones. They can use on-ramp lights to regulate incoming traffic. None of it works. The new roads fill up as soon as you build them. The widened old ones do the same thing. The on-ramp lights simply slow your entry into the quagmire, they don't solve it. Any day that most people work, there is rush hour congestion. It is a fact of life that Americans have learned to deal with. However, have you also noticed that these same roads are plenty sufficient the rest of the time? Not only that, but they are sufficient on weekends at the same times that they have problems during the week. Why is that? Is it the fault of the road builders? Is it the fault of the roads? No, it is because during the week, many if not most workers drive to work and home from work in the same short time period. And as long as that is true, the roads will continue to be congested no matter what is done to them.

It's the same principle here. It really doesn't matter what Inno does to improve on their end, because at recalc almost every GvGer will be at their keyboard clicking away. And any extra bandwidth, or server space, or processing capability will be overtaxed just like it is now. The only solution is to either convince players to spread out their GvG times, or change GvG significantly enough to get rid of the "need" for everyone to fight at once.

Incidentally, there are frequent calls to migrate GvG to the mobile platform. I see that as being the worst possible thing that could happen unless/until the problem of recalc congestion is solved one way or another.

Incidentally, the views expressed in this post are solely my own and do not necessarily reflect Inno's view or attitude.

 

[DeletedUser35285]

I don't know if it's a server or bandwidth issue or something else. All I know is that a key component of the game is broken during peak usage times and that is unacceptable. Any gaming company that is proud of their product and wants to keep players would take steps to fix this type of issue. If they don't plan to fix it then they should remove it from what they offer as part of the game.

I also find it unreasonable to think a fix isn't possible. Does Amazon shut down or go SUPER slow on Black Friday? No they don't, because there are technical solutions to fix peak load times.

 

[DeletedUser29468]

I've been an FoE player for just about 2 years, only playing GvG for one year. I'm a retired IT geek and grok the technical aspects of running gaming systems like this, and I'm a paying customer. I've been on the same hardware, with the same 50Mbs connection, and GvG has just gotten more and more glitchy. If I'm not forced to reload my client twice during GvG, it's a good night. I get that "timing issues" are going to occur, but when they are caused because the map I'm looking at isn't updating, that's unacceptable.

I've watched maps with no indication of siege on my guild, only to see one of our tiles suddenly become protected by another guild. If everybody switches back and forth between ages to get a proper view of their current map, that surely only further increases the load on server resources. But, what choice do we have?

The problems have now migrated to the messaging system. It has happened several times in the past three days of the Carnival event that I have a thread open, and submit a message only to discover I've missed one or more intervening messages because the thread hasn't updated. This is causing strife among players in some situations, which will definitely destroy the game.

C'mon, Innogames! I'm here to have fun! And, I'm spending money to do it. Frustration is *not* fun. If I don't start getting my money's worth, I'll find another game.

 

[DeletedUser6219]

I can only speak from myself, not everyone else posting here, but what I'm telling you is something was broke recently. You may know better than I if the volume of complaints have changed to support that conclusion, but from my perspective, the traffic/lane analogy, while accurate, is straw man. Yes, there will be lag, always has been lag, will always be an issue @ daily calculation, but that isn't the complaint. I described it best I could with my last post. Is it something particular to me or my system, like a windows update responsible? Maybe, but something's "up" and the 2 guilds which do most of the fighting on E. Nagach will back that up.

 

[-Athena-]

I'm with a few of you about not knowing what the underlying issues are and I will always defer to the IT guys but I like being educated on these things. I had someone explain the bandwidth concept to me when Stephen first mentioned it. She said if you think of bandwidth as a size of a pipe and users are water flowing through it when a bunch of users log on and try to go through pipe at the same time it gets clogged and goes slow (lag). Calc is at a prime time 8pm EST so we not only have GvGers we have many players on at that time finished with work, dinner, whatever. She suggested that maybe staggering calc times for the different worlds every 30 minutes. So what if we had Worlds A through E having calc at 8:30pm and and G through K at 9:00pm, etc.?
I do remember and I think it was mentioned here that they changed calc time to morning. I work so I don't know how that went but since it didn't last I'm guessing it didn't solve the problem.

But then we do also have the increased issues when events come out or other content like the Settlements that Inno introduces. And not just lag but non-lag glitches which I can list if anyone wants. I don't know if all this content is overtaxing the server or eating up server space but something is causing even these non-lag issues to increase especially in the last several weeks and even moreso in the last few days.

And I do think Inno should figure this out and find ways to make their game function better for ALL of the players. I have read in the forum how not many people GvG anymore so why should Inno bother. Well I have not seen stats on this. I do believe GvGers are under represented in this forum so this forum may not be a fair or accurate representation of the players in this game.

 

[DeletedUser]

I can only speak from myself, not everyone else posting here, but what I'm telling you is something was broke recently. You may know better than I if the volume of complaints have changed to support that conclusion, but from my perspective, the traffic/lane analogy, while accurate, is straw man. Yes, there will be lag, always has been lag, will always be an issue @ daily calculation, but that isn't the complaint. I described it best I could with my last post. Is it something particular to me or my system, like a windows update responsible? Maybe, but something's "up" and the 2 guilds which do most of the fighting on E. Nagach will back that up.

It could well be that the Carnival Event or Settlements or something else may have triggered an increase in lag/issues at recalc. But we all know that whatever might have made it worse isn't really the culprit. The reason it has gotten worse over the years, and especially within the last year or so, is simple. Autobattle. Autobattle is much more system intensive than manually fighting and we all know that. For one thing, autobattle doubles the amount of processing/decision making that the game has to do. It also crams that extra processing into a smaller time frame. There is no waiting for the player to decide how/where to move their units. There is no down time while the player sizes up the terrain and opposition. There is simply "click" and the whole battle is fought by the servers. Except it's not just one battle, or even a few battles. It's a thousand battles all being autobattled at the same time every single day. The reason that has increased so much is the hyper-leveling of attack GBs and Alcatraz. There really is not much actual fighting being done by GvGers anymore. Just hyper-level your GBs, load up with 7 Rogues and hit auto battle. Over and over. Times hundreds or thousands of other players doing the same thing...at the same time.

As far as the number of complaints issue, I can only speak for what I've seen on the Forum. I've been on here since 2015 as a player, only recently moving up to moderator. What I've seen as far as complaints about GvG is that it is pretty consistent in how/when it happens. First of all, it happens relatively infrequently. When it does happen, it is usually a flurry of complaints, often in a single thread but sometimes spread out over a couple. And most of the time it is members of one or two guilds who have decided to state their case again. And it goes on for a day or two, rarely any longer than that. And there are always threats to quit playing or quit spending. And then it gets quiet on the issue again for weeks and months at a time, with an occasional single player saying something once in a while. There is no ongoing cry on the Forum about it.

I have read in the forum how not many people GvG anymore so why should Inno bother. Well I have not seen stats on this. I do believe GvGers are under represented in this forum so this forum may not be a fair or accurate representation of the players in this game.

Inno's numbers, which they have shared publicly, show that the vast majority of players play on mobile now. Like a 3 to 1 ratio of mobile to PC. And, of course, they can't play GvG unless they go through the Puffin browser, which I've heard is a horrible experience. I would venture to guess that the number of serious GvGers is probably less than 10% of the total of active players. It is very, very easy to find a good guild that does no, or very little, GvG, and relatively hard to find a good guild that does a lot of GvG.

 

[Resipsa2]

Given that they are constantly updating, upgrading and adding features to the game, I doubt that this is the problem. Especially since they have spent the last couple of years converting the entire game from Flash to HTML-5.

Have you all never seen what happens when they try to fix the problem of rush hour congestion on the roads? Nothing ever works. They can build new roads. They can widen old ones. They can use on-ramp lights to regulate incoming traffic. None of it works. The new roads fill up as soon as you build them. The widened old ones do the same thing. The on-ramp lights simply slow your entry into the quagmire, they don't solve it. Any day that most people work, there is rush hour congestion. It is a fact of life that Americans have learned to deal with. However, have you also noticed that these same roads are plenty sufficient the rest of the time? Not only that, but they are sufficient on weekends at the same times that they have problems during the week. Why is that? Is it the fault of the road builders? Is it the fault of the roads? No, it is because during the week, many if not most workers drive to work and home from work in the same short time period. And as long as that is true, the roads will continue to be congested no matter what is done to them.

It's the same principle here. It really doesn't matter what Inno does to improve on their end, because at recalc almost every GvGer will be at their keyboard clicking away. And any extra bandwidth, or server space, or processing capability will be overtaxed just like it is now. The only solution is to either convince players to spread out their GvG times, or change GvG significantly enough to get rid of the "need" for everyone to fight at once.

Incidentally, there are frequent calls to migrate GvG to the mobile platform. I see that as being the worst possible thing that could happen unless/until the problem of recalc congestion is solved one way or another.

Incidentally, the views expressed in this post are solely my own and do not necessarily reflect Inno's view or attitude.

First, i hope that the game designers don't have that same thinking. Second, according to your analogy (which start out with a good comparison – millions of cars on hardware surfaces – roads serving the public) then there would be no need to update the Chisum Trail or any dirt road. Yes, there are traffic jams; but because of them, the city roads expand, or a significant portion of the population moves. Third, Latency is a function of network efficiency and can be influenced by multiple hops in the journey, physical distance, or other traffic on the network causing congestion. Thus, traffic jams are not simply a bandwidth problem, but a server and lack of increased network capability, after advertising and adding tens of thousands of paying players.

 

[-Athena-]

Inno's numbers, which they have shared publicly, show that the vast majority of players play on mobile now. Like a 3 to 1 ratio of mobile to PC. And, of course, they can't play GvG unless they go through the Puffin browser, which I've heard is a horrible experience. I would venture to guess that the number of serious GvGers is probably less than 10% of the total of active players. It is very, very easy to find a good guild that does no, or very little, GvG, and relatively hard to find a good guild that does a lot of GvG.

I can attest to the how horrible it is to do GvG on Puffin but I'm a die hard GvGer and I'd rather do it on there than not at all. Fortunately I play by computer 98% of the time which is why I am so frustrated that it keeps getting worse to even GvG on that now. GvG is why many of us even play FOE other than the friends we have made that we get to fight alongside with and the frenemies and enemies we fight against. It's truly a fun experience that has just become so frustrating.

 

[DeletedUser38310]

@Stephen Longshanks you really need to quit making excuses for INNO. Your input is nothing more than nonsense.

I have played this game since PE was the highest age. We the GVG players have heavily funded this game. We have paid for INNO's ability to make commercials for tv. We have paid their salaries. We have paid so that the mobile players can play. The problem is the corporate greed and the brain washed moderators who try and shove the garbage down our throats. We have come to our wits end. We have had enough. I, like so many others refuse to do any more silly events and or purchase diamonds until this problem is corrected.

This a fighting game damn it, NOT Farmville.

 

[Goth Almighty]

Incidentally, the views expressed in this post are solely my own and do not necessarily reflect Inno's view or attitude.

Mr Longshanks, you're copping out, eh? Obviously, you're being paid by or receiving benefits from Inno and, if your remarks don't reflect their views, you just don't have the authority to express their views. Get someone from Inno on here who has the authority to express Inno's views. If you don't, we can assume Inno's views are to just blow wind.

 

[DeletedUser]

Mr Longshanks, you're copping out, eh? Obviously, you're being paid by or receiving benefits from Inno and, if your remarks don't reflect their views, you just don't have the authority to express their views. Get someone from Inno on here who has the authority to express Inno's views. If you don't, we can assume Inno's views are to just blow wind.

You see, that's the drawback to you all venting here. Someone from Inno who has the authority to say what they're thinking or planning as far as GvG goes is not going to show up here. I am only relating my views based on my knowledge and personal observations. Which is my right, whether there is a label under my name or not. I do know that every member of the moderating staff on this forum is well aware of the complaints with regards to GvG. And since Inno has mentioned GvG in their Facebook videos, I'm pretty sure that they are aware, also.

 

[DeletedUser]

Hey Longshanks, I know you dont GVG. Give it a shot tonight and then come back here and try to sell your nonsense. Otherwise your input is moot.

I don't drive in rush hour traffic either, but I still understand it. And I have done GvG in the past. I don't do much of it now because I don't like it...which has nothing to do with lag. I don't like it even if there's no lag.

 

[DeletedUser38310]

Exactly why your input is moot. Us players who GVG DO DRIVE IN IT. WHY? Because thats when the fighting is to protect your land and to attack your enemies. That is what GVG is. We the players did not invent GVG, INNO did. INNO dictated the time. We just follow it. Longshanks, if you're not going to help the problem, then shut up. Your views are no longer wanted.

 

[Toppcatt]

I just want a clean fight with my enemies, two of which are already on this thread and were among the first to respond. It's amazing how such a basal infection in the platform can unite even the the most disparate of factions. GvG is truly on it's last foot.

I have been playing GvG almost daily since the start, and I have NEVER seen lag/bugs as bad as they've been since this carnival event started. It has been horrendous each night since (3 nights now). Noticeably worse than ever, by a factor of 3 -- at least. I doubt that is a coincidence. I doubt Inno is unaware of the resource tug-o-war. I also doubt they care, but the players care. And some of them buy your bluebies.

From the start, I have built my city around one central question: How will this help my guild in GvG? If you're not going to support GvG, either say so or dismantle it completely so I can waste my time elsewhere, because I have absolutely no interest in your GE or your stupid little quests, or your 5-piece nightmarish event sets that STILL can't be moved as a single unit.

I have heard Tai and Kai, or whatever their names are -- your PR spokespeople -- on their live Facebook chats laughing off the idea of fixing GvG as if it's some sort of insurmountable task unworthy of pursuit. COME CLEAN WITH YOUR ORIGINAL PLAYER BASE THAT BROUGHT YOU THE SUCCESS YOU ENJOY TODAY. Are you going to fix it or not? You are about to lose a lot of players. No joke.

It wasn't just GvG that was having this lag, but just the plain game itself, and this is with me NOT even having the animations going. The lag in GE was really bad also, and it took me almost 5 mins, just to get the support page up, to be able to put in a support complaint ticket. DOH!!

 

[-Athena-]

Let's keep the thread focused please. People are free to express their views. This is not about each other this is about the issues we are having in GvG and getting Inno to stop paying lip service to these very real problems that affect many of us (spenders and non-spenders) who want to continue playing this game.

And the fact that there are people in this thread that I know are truly not fans of one another working on the same side of this amicably speaks volumes to the fact that this is not about you, me, them.This is about us.

 

[RazorbackPirate]

Mr Longshanks, you're copping out, eh? Obviously, you're being paid by or receiving benefits from Inno and, if your remarks don't reflect their views, you just don't have the authority to express their views. Get someone from Inno on here who has the authority to express Inno's views. If you don't, we can assume Inno's views are to just blow wind.

@Stephen Longshanks is free to express his personal views on the issue. The fact that he moderates the forum does not put a muzzle on him. You should also realize that his unpaid volunteer position affords him no special access to authority to demand they come on here to answer your complaint.

As you can see, Inno has remained silent on this issue. What does that silence tell you? In their silence, the answer can be found. I sympathize, I really do. A part of the game you love and have grown attached to is being left to wither away from intentional neglect. I'm sorry that's the way it is, but that's reality. You need to accept it.

When Inno announced there would be no GvG maps after FE, they were essentially saying they would be making no further investments in GvG as is. The fact that GvG runs on PC only and PC players are an ever shrinking % of their ever increasing user base is why. No amount of posts, threads, users, all complaining about a known issue isn't going to change the business reality. It doesn't make financial sense for Inno to invest in GvG as is. If it did, they would.

So it doesn't matter why you started playing GvG, how much you love GvG, how frustrated you are with GvG, what you think the problem is with GvG, how long the lag has been a problem with GvG, since the event how much worse it's been in GvG, what you think can be done to fix GvG, what you think should be done to fix GvG, how easy you think it is to fix GvG, or how desperately a fix is needed for GvG. None of it matters. Inno knows all of it.

It sucks I know, but it is what it is, none of that matters. GvG won't be fixed today, it won't be fixed next week, it won't be fixed before the end of the event, it won't be fixed after the event, it won't be fixed before the next event, and it certainly won't be fixed from this thread, any of the posts in it, or how many post to it. Are you seeing a trend here? It won't be fixed. Period. Full Stop.

All you can do is soldier on in the face of GvG being FUBAR during the event. Think of the countdown clock as the timer until you get some relief. At some point beating you're head against the wall has got to hurt. You can see it doesn't help or even make a difference.

Let's hope at some point Inno creates a new guild based fighting extension that everyone can access. Until they do, you just need to suck it up and play it the way it is, warts and all.

 

[superjaded]

You see, that's the drawback to you all venting here. Someone from Inno who has the authority to say what they're thinking or planning as far as GvG goes is not going to show up here. I am only relating my views based on my knowledge and personal observations. Which is my right, whether there is a label under my name or not. I do know that every member of the moderating staff on this forum is well aware of the complaints with regards to GvG. And since Inno has mentioned GvG in their Facebook videos, I'm pretty sure that they are aware, also.

So how do we go about reporting the problems that are affecting so many. You say those on the moderating staff on forum are well aware of the complaints in regards to GVG.. The customer support reps Senior and non senior members alike keep asking us for more proof of the "bad lag at reset time" and keep insisting we try to clear cache and all the other pointless steps we have tried day in and day out only to return with the same amount of lag if not more. If you all want more "Proof" try logging into East Nagach server at 8 pm eastern. Get an invite from one of the top guilds there that GVG daily (I'm sure they would love to show you more proof and would have no problem inviting any of you to their guild to observe it first hand). IF the forums and support can't get the word to INNO that their is definitely a problem here affecting a lot of players. Who can? After too much time spent traveling these "Congested roads" Were going to either find a new route to travel by. Or forge our own roads elsewhere where the Mobile and PC players alike can enjoy all parts of the game provided for them. Ignore the problems they don't get fixed Speak out about the problems and they still don't get fixed. What else can be done?

 

[-Athena-]

@Stephen Longshanks

All you can do is soldier on in the face of GvG being FUBAR during the event. Think of the countdown clock as the timer until you get some relief. At some point beating you're head against the wall has got to hurt. You can see it doesn't help or even make a difference.

Which would be fine except for the fact that events are happening so frequently these days. It feels like every week to 1 1/2 weeks there is another starting.

 

[Colb777]

Even assuming you're right, which I'm not conceding, why would Inno spend so much money on such a minor part of the game. And it is minor now, whether you want to admit it or not. Maybe not minor for you, but minor in the grand scheme of things. With the majority of players now using mobile rather than PC, along with the addition of GE and more events, it's just not economically sensible to spend much money improving infrastructure simply to make it better for GvG.

That may be true, but Inno's revenues haven't taken a hit, meaning that the...

...have apparently made up for any revenue shortfalls from GvGers who quit spending.

Incidentally, the views expressed in this post are solely my own and do not necessarily reflect Inno's view or attitude.

I could argue that there wouldn't be a mobile platform if it were not for the commercial success of the game in the first place and a majority of the spenders who helped fund mobile itself are very active and appreciative of GvG. Again I cannot speak for everyone (nor can I guess as to what propelled the release of the mobile platform) but I am quite certain a plethora of players began to taper off their diamond habits as a result of this continuous issue. I'm not just saying the correlation between the two is all that matters but to a company that isn't a charity, the people who helped build this game by not only spreading the word, actively participating and building relationships among each other (good or bad) were part of a foundation of clients that did a lot to get others involved. It's not just the money. If it were, I'd be encouraged to say that I once spent over $1000 in a week on this game, the week GvG was released.

Perhaps GvG is only a small measure of the game overall, but it's not like the settlements or Guild Expedition comes close to making up for it. The Events would be much more appreciated if they didn't clutter up so much of the game and weren't so frequent. I used to buy diamonds every event until they came around more often than full moons.

Perhaps if InnoGames wants to keep running it with such an embarrassing level of performance, maybe you should just get rid of it all together and we can play Forge of Empires like Farmville

 

[DeletedUser17454]

Fighting in gvg has reached a new low. After clearing cache and dusting off the keyboard. And grabbing some troops to go to war. This time is in utter chaos as the game clearly prevents us from having a True Battle. The lag that I experience at reset in gvg is a real issue. I will hit Attack and it just sits there with the Inno Emblem spinning in a frozen state in the center of my screen, as I watch the fight continue (most recently even the fight appears to be in a frozen state) This is so wrong. Forge of Empires needs there cache cleared, it seriously needs to be addressed by the technicians, higher ups, etc.
Surely the money I have spent to open up the last rogue, or the final Unit in my troop barick's is a waste of my money When I am not able to fight on the gvg map. This is a Guild oriented fightin game. I am in the Forum today to ask you, Please hear out concerns and do the Right Thing' Get Rid of the Lag.