Why not protect users?

[Pericles the Lion]

They are most easy to see if you are an active GvG player. On other parts of the game it is a bit harder, but if you want to find out, just use Google or YouTube. Someone in this thread has a YouTube channel that will show you.

I've seen several YouTube videos showing suspected bot use in GBG. They show rapid speed loading of sectors. None were different from what my guild does on every swap. 20 advanced hitters with 1000+ attack boost can flip a diamond sector in under 15 seconds using no bots. Players that haven't experienced the game from the perspective of a top guild may not understand that loading a sector in 15 seconds is commonplace. They see cheating when there is none.

 

[UBERhelp1]

I've seen several YouTube videos showing suspected bot use in GBG. They show rapid speed loading of sectors. None were different from what my guild does on every swap. 20 advanced hitters with 1000+ attack boost can flip a diamond sector in under 15 seconds using no bots. Players that haven't experienced the game from the perspective of a top guild may not understand that loading a sector in 15 seconds is commonplace. They see cheating when there is none.

This. It's easy to see something going fast and think it's one player. It's entirely another thing when you have many people working together.

Now, if, say, there's a video of a one person guild tearing through GvG on their own, then that's another story.

 

[Jern2017]

This. It's easy to see something going fast and think it's one player. It's entirely another thing when you have many people working together.

Now, if, say, there's a video of a one person guild tearing through GvG on their own, then that's another story.

I know we're talking about GVG here, but what about certain players with 15K or more fights in GBG per season? It's not about how fast some sectors are taken, because that obviously depends on the amount of players fighting on it, but how certain individuals are able to achieve that many fights.

 

[Ebeondi Asi]

I know we're talking about GVG here, but what about certain players with 15K or more fights in GBG per season? It's not about how fast some sectors are taken, because that obviously depends on the amount of players fighting on it, but how certain individuals are able to achieve that many fights.

In my opinion it is the notion "if I can't do it... no one can" syndrome.

 

[Johnny B. Goode]

Just my two cents worth, but I know of at least two cases where players who I suspected of using multiple accounts disappeared without a trace. One of them was fairly active here in the Forum several years ago. Two cases might not sound like much, but keep in mind that I neither care whether others are cheating, nor do I ever look for evidence of such. It's just happenstance that I know of these two cases, but if someone as oblivious to cheating as myself notices two players disappearing (and presumably banned*), the logic says that there are many, many more.

*I say "presumably banned" because in the first case I was alerted by another player that the one in question appeared to have multiple accounts, and after that I was more sensitive to the subject for a bit and so noticed the signs with the second player.

I know we're talking about GVG here, but what about certain players with 15K or more fights in GBG per season? It's not about how fast some sectors are taken, because that obviously depends on the amount of players fighting on it, but how certain individuals are able to achieve that many fights.

Easy. Swapping sectors. The last GBG session on my main world, I had over 1500 fights and I'm in a two person guild in Gold league that does no swapping of sectors. I could easily see someone in a Diamond guild getting 15,000 fights with swapping of sectors.

 

[spartacus2.0]

Sorry if this is a little too off topic but...

My concern is the hostile environment that is created for new players. Global is usually where new players come to ask for help, and they often get met with a hostile environment.

I don't mind the mild trolling and back and forth between guilds. What I am referring is to a player who constantly calls names and denigrates other players. That person also takes things outside the game and gets personal information about players and shares it on Global.

Perhaps Inno should have add a profanity filter that turns all those swear words and insults to asterisks.
Maybe they already do (I haven't been on the global chat for nearly a year LOL) (I get all my info from the fandom, Youtube, and UBERhelp1's guides.)
Also cyberbullying is common in all the videogames with a chat. The best way to avoid it is to not open global chat

 

[DevaCat]

I know we're talking about GVG here, but what about certain players with 15K or more fights in GBG per season? It's not about how fast some sectors are taken, because that obviously depends on the amount of players fighting on it, but how certain individuals are able to achieve that many fights.

Like JBG said, farming mainly. Takes high atk boosts, a favorable map, ability to be engaged on the map schedule, and not too much competition for fights from your own guild mates. I’ve seen +12k a few times in diamond, 15k isn’t surprising or out of the question for someone to achieve without resorting to cheating.

 

[UBERhelp1]

I know we're talking about GVG here, but what about certain players with 15K or more fights in GBG per season? It's not about how fast some sectors are taken, because that obviously depends on the amount of players fighting on it, but how certain individuals are able to achieve that many fights.

I can hit well over 2k per season with SCs regularly with only about 45 minutes fighting per day. If you have no life and good swaps, there's no reason you can't hit that. you might get carpal tunnels, but you could do it.

 

[Kranyar the Mysterious]

I hit over 25k battles one season. That was a one off situation, but never use number of battles to declare someone Asa cheater.

 

[Emberguard]

but what about certain players with 15K or more fights in GBG per season? It's not about how fast some sectors are taken, because that obviously depends on the amount of players fighting on it, but how certain individuals are able to achieve that many fights.

There’s 11 days per season.

15,000 / 11 = 1,363 fights per day / 160 fights per sector (diamond league) = 8.5 sectors per day.

There’s 61 sectors per map, and if we assume a 4 hr rotation over 12 hrs then a player only need to find 9 sectors out of 183 sectors (that’s restricting it to 12 hrs, we could make it 16 hrs for 244 possible sectors)

15k fights is more than doable as long as you have the tiles set up. While sometimes you’ll have a bunch of players online, there are plenty of times you may only have one or two players loading up the sectors for the swaps. One or two players in a Guild having those numbers is far from unusual, likely means they’re the ones logging in the most frequently and organising all the swaps.

 

[Pericles the Lion]

On my main I am in a very active GBG guild. During a typical swap I average 225-250 battles. When motivated I'll take part in 4, maybe 5 swaps daily. If I want, it's not difficult for me to reach 10K battles in season and I'm not the top performer in my guild. Nobody is cheating.

 

[Galechade]

We appreciate the feedback, and please send us the video evidences and everything else you find relevant in a ticket. It's the proper channel for such reports.

I've also reported the use of bots and have multiple videos. Inno doesn't want the videos. The mod I dealt with says "we have our own ways of telling if someone is cheating." The problem is your ways are outdated. Shorten up that time span you use to see the glitches and see for yourself. It would help if there were actual programmers who know how to use the cheats, to find them in game. But then that would be fixing some of the issues with GVG which we all know Inno is dead set against. So sad since GVG is what made this game so popular, long before GE, GBG and mobile were even thought of.

 

[Agent327]

There’s 11 days per season.

15,000 / 11 = 1,363 fights per day / 160 fights per sector (diamond league) = 8.5 sectors per day.

There’s 61 sectors per map, and if we assume a 4 hr rotation over 12 hrs then a player only need to find 9 sectors out of 183 sectors (that’s restricting it to 12 hrs, we could make it 16 hrs for 244 possible sectors)

15k fights is more than doable as long as you have the tiles set up. While sometimes you’ll have a bunch of players online, there are plenty of times you may only have one or two players loading up the sectors for the swaps. One or two players in a Guild having those numbers is far from unusual, likely means they’re the ones logging in the most frequently and organising all the swaps.

The number of fights doable is not relevant here. If the sectors are available there are a lot of players that can do that number of fights. What is relevant is the time it takes them. A player doing 15.000 fights on a day GBG is not even active does make you wonder. Not only how much time it took to do those fights, but also how you can mentally bring up the strength to do it. Even without having to change any units, that is an enormous number of repetetive movements. If I am on my own in GBG and have taken 3 sectors in a row I am starting to hope there will be no SC's on the next sector taken, so I can stop.

 

[Emberguard]

What is relevant is the time it takes them.

I agree, if you want to look at bot usage then it'd be more relevant to look at the time taken rather than skipping to the final result. That number is far too easy to obtain via legitimate means as long as you're logging in regularly after the first day of a season

If I am on my own in GBG and have taken 3 sectors in a row I am starting to hope there will be no SC's on the next sector taken, so I can stop.

Same. After 3 sectors I would be looking to stop. But if you're logging in throughout the day then on your own you'd only need 3 sectors at a time, three times a day.

. A player doing 15.000 fights on a day GBG is not even active does make you wonder.

We were talking throughout the season which would be realistic to achieve, not just one day.

I'm not expecting anyone to do 15k in a single day for Guild Battlegrounds. That would require taking over the entire board one and a half times. That's just not gonna happen without coordination with other Guilds taking back sectors. But if it's so quiet you can cover the whole board solo within a day, then pretty likely there aren't any other Guilds to coordinate with in that fashion.

But over a season? Nothing suspicious if it's over 11 days

 

[Agent327]

Same. After 3 sectors I would be looking to stop. But if you're logging in throughout the day then on your own you'd only need 3 sectors at a time, three times a day.

I log in throughout the day and I have never encountered that situation.

I'm not expecting anyone to do 15k in a single day for Guild Battlegrounds. That would require taking over the entire board one and a half times. That's just not gonna happen without coordination with other Guilds taking back sectors. But if it's so quiet you can cover the whole board solo within a day, then pretty likely there aren't any other Guilds to coordinate with in that fashion.

But over a season? Nothing suspicious if it's over 11 days

This is 15k over 1 day when GBG is not even open.

 

[Emberguard]

This is 15k over 1 day when GBG is not even open.

Then they're fighting outside of GBG. Which could be GvG or PvP Arena (or both)

 

[Johnny B. Goode]

This is 15k over 1 day when GBG is not even open.

Are you saying you've seen this? Because that's not what the statement/question was that we were talking about. Here's what everyone's been responding to:

I know we're talking about GVG here, but what about certain players with 15K or more fights in GBG per season? It's not about how fast some sectors are taken, because that obviously depends on the amount of players fighting on it, but how certain individuals are able to achieve that many fights.

As you can see, the statement/question was about 15k fights in GBG...per season. Not 15k in one day.

 

[RazorbackPirate]

@mellofax, unless you can point to a law that prevents Inno from disclosing the results of your investigations, it's an arbitrary rule invoked by Inno to avoid transparency. If an arbitrary rule, it's one that can be changed. You'd think the fear of public disclosure would have a dampening effect, but that would require actual results to report of penalties worth reporting. Which then would require actually watching the myriad of videos you've already been supplied and actually taking the issue seriously.

To be fair, I think most of this is out of Inno's control anyway. I suspect in the myriad of consumer protection laws between Germany, the EU, and US, once a player has spent any money on the game, to take any real punitive measures, the burden of proof becomes too high for Inno to provide any effective enforcement of their own game rules. Hence why we're told not to trust our lying eyes that show nothing more than the occasional "time out" ban before the cheaters are right back in business. It could very well be the radio silence and the, "just because you don't see it..." happy gas are really designed to cover for the fact that Inno can't do much to enforce their rules even if they wanted to. Something cheaters would know as well which is why they act so brazenly with impunity.

There are also the two inescapable financial realities that every Euro spent on rules enforcement is one less Euro in profit and Inno's fiduciary responsibilities are towards their investors, not their customers. Inno needs to invest enough to keep up the appearances that they care, it is a fiduciary responsibility to protect the reputation of the company. However, excessive investment beyond that quickly becomes a breach of Inno's fiduciary responsibilities to their investors to maximize the profits delivered to them. No where in this tension do results play a role. It's about protecting the company's reputation at the lowest possible cost.

I think these two together leave us where we are and where I expect we'll stay. A company that does what it can within the rules they must operate using the limited tools they're willing to invest in.

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[Johnny B. Goode]

You'd think the fear of public disclosure would have a dampening effect, but that would require actual results to report of penalties worth reporting.

You don't really believe that, right? This is the Internet. If they don't fear being banned, why would they fear "public disclosure". Which, incidentally, would only consist of an arbitrary game name being published within the game and/or Forum. The only people that would deter are the ones that won't do it anyway.

 

[Emberguard]

unless you can point to a law that prevents Inno from disclosing the results of your investigations,

Can you go up to a doctor and ask for the results of a patient? No? Why? Privacy laws. How about going up to a police officer and asking about their investigations? Same thing.